eBay Adds Protections for INR Claims in UK

by: Rexford

UK and European laws are pretty good and fair when it comes to protections. Did the UK implement a law that forced this?  If not, why not the USA too?

by: pace306

1) I couldnt be more happy that eBay has to eat (I know say "reimburse" as it makes the eBay boys/girls happy) any late refunds. Anytime eBay has to pay OUT funds ... puts a smile on my face - and it should put one on YOURS too! (anytime the evil empire takes a hit is a GOOD day)

2) the entire thing IS not needed at all - ie it WOULDNT BE if eBay just kept its nose out of things it has no control over. Despite eBays cash on hand position aka paying people and companies off - they CANT do it to Royal Mail (known for poor service) and USPS (whose parcel business only exists because they are cheaper then Fed Ex and UPS) to make things "go faster". Amazon ('cause people here LOVE to compare them), decided to have its OWN courier service - just to deal with these issues ..... If you wouldnt promise things that you have zero control over - it wont be necessary to refund ANYONE.

3) I guess no one at eBay was alive when you saw tv commercials for some knickknacks and you had to wait 6-8 weeks for it AND pay shipping and handling ... lord knows we all lived just fine. In eBay land, run by Gen Z morons AND greedy Mafioso's, they think everything should be shipped same day, for free and should get there in 1-2 days - regardless of cost to the seller, jut cause.

DOPES

4) As Rex said so well - is this happening here in the US for US based sellers? And if NOT, why not?

5) With todays  software etc - it can see that an item was shipped and accepted at the PO - so why is this an issue. USPS as an example, CLEARLY tells you if an item is late and most times where it is (most but not all). Why should ANY seller who shipped on time and has "acceptance" even be bothered with this AT ALL? ITs another way that eBay creates BS for no good reason. Once it shipped, a seller shouldnt have to refund ANYTHING. If its late - thats life. If you want overnight service, PAY FOR IT. UPS Ground, Fed EX Home, USPS GA are all slower ground based services and because costs are expensive and eBays taking a FAT cut (for doing nothing and for no reason), sellers ship the cheapest way possible. Get eBays fingers out of the pie and MAYBE we can all ship faster. Once its shipped - a seller should be done, except on eBay where the seller runs the shipping companies too!

by: Snapped

“ Used a tracked shipping service purchased via eBay labels on our platform.”

Given that the exact same circumstances may occur for the more ‘independently minded’ sellers who may find obtaining shipping might be cheaper elsewhere, yet won’t be similarly ‘protected ‘, it ought to be clear to anybody that eBay has done the math here,

They make money on the shipping label.  They make money on the float.  They make money on the transaction.  And increase the shipping label profit if ‘more’ sellers buy into it. And that all pays for the (relatively) occasional ‘impatient’ buyer.  

Nothing wrong with incentivizing of course.  But such an application given the fact there is no difference in the issue ‘otherwise’ means it’s more about helping eBay than it is about protecting a seller.  For them to pretend otherwise, is just their typical disingenuous approach to service.

by: Rexford

Snapped says "For them to pretend otherwise, is just their typical disingenuous approach to service."

Bingo.  We all knew that it was just a matter of time before they used the "purchased via eBay labels on our platform" excuse for not having a seller's back.  The tracking number clearly shows that the seller sent it, but that's just not good enough for Greedbay.

I wonder if anyone has kept up with all the ways that eBay has screwed sellers over the years. It would be certainly be an interesting read.

by: terry55

Coming soon to USA? September seller news stated new seller protections for INR are going into effect for the USA, I could have sworn I heard it was suppose to Start in October but can't find that info now. It be really nice to start it before USPS starts losing packages for the holidays

by: my2cents

It is always important to make sure you find fault in something that will help many sellers.  Who gives a darn if you have to purchase the shipping label on Ebay.  Of course that is easy for me to say since I only use USPS.  I actually understand why others that you different carriers would use other ways of purchasing their labels.  Very good reasons for doing so.

Since I do ship via USPS most of the time, I buy most of my labels on Ebay.  I have not ran into many issues over the years.  It works for me as it likely works for many other sellers.  

This change in Seller Protection is VERY good for many sellers.  Each of us have a choice.  If you want to the coverage, purchase your shipping labels in Ebay.  If you don't care one way or the other, purchase your shipping labels from whatever vendor you want.  As long as it works for you, that is the important thing.

But those of us that do use Ebay labels are not less than anyone else.  And I'm very happy to get this added coverage.

by: Rexford

my2cents says "This change in Seller Protection is VERY good for many sellers.  Each of us have a choice.  If you want to the coverage, purchase your shipping labels in Ebay."

You say "each of us have a choice" followed by "if you want coverage, purchase your labels in eBay".

Clarification to you statement:  If one wants protection, purchase labels on eBay.  So much for choice.    eBay's "choice" works for you.  So the hell with everyone else, right?  Do you simply refuse to see that this is coercion by eBay...since it works for you.   Perhaps you won't be so lucky with the next change that eBay makes that does not work in your favor.

by: Snapped

“ It is always important to make sure you find fault in something that will help many sellers. ”

That is an inaccurate depiction of both motivation and content.  

It is always important to point to any ‘choice’ when it involves coercive manipulation, don’t you think? It is only circumstance that this particular boon to the king’s sycophants will also NOT be ANY “good for many sellers” who DO “care one way or the other”.

So the real “choice” here is reduced to whether one finds ‘conditional love’ to be a “fault” or not.  

To that particular question, one may care to consider this: Whenever any business entity advertises a particular ‘benefit’, (setting aside for the moment any discussion related to ‘it’s about damn time’), why do they always put ‘terms and conditions may apply’ in small print, buried at the bottom?  

eBay, you see, is touting this ‘protection’ as a result of their ‘listening’ to the “noise”.  Only by digging into the language does one discover their terms and conditions to withhold their just as easily discernible ‘protections’ for any who don’t choose the eBay product competing with potentially cheaper alternatives - including those who don’t HAVE a choice.

Had eBay announced this long overdue ‘benefit’ as being an enhancement to THEIR shipping service product instead, which is ALL it really is, then there would be no factual basis to call it two-faced, would there?  

by: pace306

It is always important to make sure you find out HOW the people you do business with are trying to screw you" ...... there - fixed it for you.  

Maybe you would like to explain how this is ANY kind of "benefit" or in YOUR TERMS "something good"?

If a seller shipped an item and its IN TRANSIT, what would you like a seller to do (to make it "go faster") ??

If it was shipped ON TIME and its IN TRANSIT, the seller is done (unless its lost/never arrives OR arrives and its SNAD).

Lying to people and telling them that ONLY if you buy labels on eBay (so they can make money off them), then and ONLY then will we do the right thing and step in and help ... is fraud, manipulation and is EXACTLY what the mafia does. PAY YOUR PROTECTION MONEY and ACCIDENTS WONT HAPPEN.

Its eBays fault to begin with that theres an issue - THEY made false promises, not the seller. Theres ZERO reason that they seller should be on the hook at all.

Paying eBay a VIG so that they will help you later on (AFTER they screwed up) is criminal.

I randomly check to see if the pricing is the same or close. If it is - Ill use eBay for the sheer convenience - nothing more

"we aint brothers, we aint partners and we aint friends.

eBay made $20 billion last year, most of which which stolen in some form from sellers - boo hoo if they have to pay up for THEIR mistakes.

by: my2cents

@Rexford
"So the hell with everyone else, right?"  I'm sorry you feel that way, but that is nothing I said or implied.  You have to do what is right and works for you.  Those are things we each need to do.  Because it works for me, I'm not going to apologize for that because it doesn't work for you.  

I'm not defending Ebay's choice of how the program works.  I'm simply saying it will work for many sellers and sellers have been asking for this for a very long time.

by: my2cents

@snapped
I'm unsure of this being a "long overdue" benefit on Ebay.  Certainly sellers have been asking for help on this subject at least since the Pandemic.  But I sell on multiple sites and Ebay is the only site I use that has this protection.  

While some sellers won't be able to use it, many others will.  It is a positive move by Ebay IMHO.

by: my2cents

@pace
"Lying to people and telling them that ONLY if you buy labels on eBay (so they can make money off them), then and ONLY then will we do the right thing and step in and help ... is fraud, manipulation and is EXACTLY what the mafia does."

How is Ebay "lying" about this new protection?  How is it "fraud"?  The new protection appears to be clearly described.  Because you don't like it doesn't in turn make it bad.  It means you don't like it and/or you can't use it.

Wherever you are buying your shipping labels from is making money off you.  Otherwise how could they stay in business.  Ebay isn't the lowest shipping in some classification but in others they are the same as other sites.  You just need to compare what methods of shipment you use and decide what is the best deal for you.  But ALL sites that offer shipping labels make money off those that buy shipping labels from them.  IDK why you seem to feel that Ebay shouldn't.

by: Snapped

“How is Ebay "lying" about this new protection?”

“ eBay got right to the heart of the matter for sellers in its Seller Announcement Board post on Thursday when it said it had heard from sellers that one of their biggest frustrations is when delivery delays lead to Item Not Received (INR) claims, only for the item to show up days after being forced to refund the buyer.”

If some kind of eBay epiphany is the true motivation for their benevolence, why is their ‘hearing’ selective?  

Because that is not their motivation.  They are only monetizing their ‘empathy’.  
It really doesn’t take much critical thinking to see that their declaration of motivation for their ‘protection’, despite limiting conditions which may be disclosed, or any ‘right’ to profit implied, is nevertheless rendered…..Significantly Not As Described.  

by: my2cents

@snapped

Still they didn't lie about anything that I'm aware of.  Because you and others may not like the requirements for this new protection, does not mean that many sellers will love it.

And yes many many many sellers have been asking Ebay for help in this area  .

by: Just Great

I had them reverse a chargeback once, but after that, nothing. I don’t understand why they can’t help us here in the U.S. It doesn’t seem fair that other countries get special treatment; that kind of enforcement should apply everywhere.

by: Snapped

Know what the most insidious part about this whole scheme is, that nobody has mentioned yet?

eBay is the one who makes the delivery date promise.  And then judges the seller based on it, regardless of the cause or fault, and independent of any INR claim existing.  Seems there will be no protection from those.  

Maybe they’ll set a purchase volume threshold or something when they get around to ‘hearing’ THOSE seller’s pleas.  

by: Shanna

@my2cents,

Ole Griff said back in the days of him and Jeff lying to their eBay seller customers that eBay made no money off of shipping labels. Why would he say that? Of course, they make a lot of money off of labels, probably more than they make off of FVFs. During a Congressional hearing on the losses posted by USPS, a Congressman asked the postmaster about their deal with Amazon. He said he hear Amazon was paying as little as 20 cents on the dollar toward retail pricing on postage. As a semi independent government agency, that by the way asked Congress for billions to bail them out, he told the Congressman that their contracts were confidential. He never denied the below costs pricing, though. Now that Amazon is delivering their own packages, eBay has to be their largest customer.

So they surely have a similar deal, and yet they do not pass any savings to their sellers. That is why they push returns so much, they would rather make money on the postage both ways that to keep the FVF. Ebay once promised that return shipping would never be more than outgoing costs, but now they will not print a Media Mail label for a return, pushing you into 3x the cost Priority Mail.

Once upon a time TRS sellers got a 3% discount on Priority, but today Priority is much more expensive and eBay has dropped any discount for TRS sellers. They could offer a 5% discount and people would flock back to them for labels, making them even more money, but no one at eBay understands volume pricing.

With that, I prefer to give my money to Stamps.com and Pirateship. Both allow be to buy postage with my points rewards credit card.

by: my2cents

Countless things change over time.  Not just on Ebay, but in every part of lives.  I'm unsure as to what hanging onto bad feelings about old programs or something someone said a decade or more ago serves us in any positive way.

I buy my postage on Ebay and I DO use my credit card with Cash back bonuses.  You can use your credit card of choice if you set it up in PayPal and then select paying for your Ebay shipping labels with PayPal.