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Mon June 13 2022 16:02:22

Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows Delivered

By: Reader

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Dear Ina,
I'd like some input from those that may read this regarding Selling on Amazon. I've been selling there for many years and I have recently ran into an issue that has never happened in all the years I've been there and of course their customer service is of no help whatsoever.

Last week I had two INRs (item not received) A to Z claims filed. The first one the tracking showed delivered and Amazon refunded the buyer out of Amazon funds.

The second INR was slightly different. This one they are making me refund. I added info to the claim that showed the tracking showed received and the emails between the buyer and I on Amazon that clearly showed the buyer said the item was stollen. All though I'm not sure that was true as the emails between us had some stuff that made me think she had the item.

In all my years I have not had to refund on an INR with tracking that shows delivered. I've spent a lot of time appealing and calling Amazon but to no avail. No one seems to be able to answer if there has been a policy change on this subject. And they won't tell me why they decided to refund both of these buyers.

The A to Z Department will only communicate with me via email, we are not allowed to talk to them. All I get from them is that "Although we understand your position, we stand by our decision. We cannot give you more information about this matter, and we may not reply to further emails about this claim."

So in a nutshell if a policy change has happened they simply don't feel the need or responsibility to let the sellers know. Anyone else have problems like this with INRs? What did you do? Were you ever able to get any information out of them?
Marie



Comments (26) | Permalink

Readers Comments

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: WalmartClassAction This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 14 14:12:17 2022

You need to use Buy Shipping or require signature confirmation at delivery. Amazon doesn't care what the tracking says unless you have signature confirmation or use Buy Shipping. We use Buy Shipping for every single order and Amazon pays the frauds off.

This does nothing to actually fix the problem (Amazon simply paying off every fraud that claims their order didn't arrive) but it protects you and forces Amazon to pay the claim.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

This user has validated their user name. by: Marie

Tue Jun 14 14:22:33 2022

This is something new.  It is not cost effective to require a signature except on expensive items, none of these were expensive.

@WalmartClassAction, what do you mean by "Buy Shipping"??  Of course I bought shipping otherwise there would not be any tracking on the package nor would it have been delivered to the buyer.  If I don't purchase shipping from Amazon I always update the sale on Amazon with the tracking number.  With that said, both of these items had the shipping purchased on the Amazon site.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: WalmartClassAction This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 14 15:22:22 2022

What I mean by "Buy Shipping" is using the yellow Buy Shipping button on the order details page. If you ship on time with Buy Shipping, Amazon is supposed to cover any non-delivery A-Z claims for that order. We used to use signature confirmation but it was definitely not cost effective and most customers aren't available during the day to sign for the delivery. We deal with consumer electronics (very high fraud category) and Amazon has always (with a handful of exceptions) covered any non-delivery A-Z claim when we've use the Buy Shipping label and gotten the acceptance scan on time.  

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

This user has validated their user name. by: Marie

Wed Jun 15 02:11:04 2022

@WalmartClassAction

If you read the letter I wrote, that is NOT what Amazon did which is why I'm confused.  And the tracking on BOTH the packages show the item was delivered to the buyer, shipped on time and arrived within the estimated ETA.  Yet Amz paid one buyer out of Amz money and the other one they forced the payment from my money.

This is the first time I've ever had to refund someone on Amz when the tracking showed delivered, when the buyer claims an INR.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: UB This user has validated their user name.

Wed Jun 15 06:08:29 2022

Did you buy your shipping labels from Amazon??????

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: UB This user has validated their user name.

Wed Jun 15 06:11:45 2022

Since now, I see you bought the shipping labels from Amazon maybe you have a case for a lawyer since you should be covered according to Amazon policies. A Class action lawsuit?? Since I am sure you are not the only one.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

This user has validated their user name. by: Rexford

Wed Jun 15 07:43:12 2022

At the point that they pull this on me I will delete all of my Amazon listings.  I can put up with a lot but not a platform that steals from me.  Delivery confirmation marked received means delivered.  Sellers should not be responsible for the actions of porch pirates and such.  Not to mention that the buyer could be lying.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Wed Jun 15 11:07:37 2022

Delivery confirmation is useless on Amazon, as is USPS showing a porch or mailbox delivery.

ONLY signature delivery counts to them.

As for exactly what happened in the OPs case - no idea since the overseas CS wont share the reasons.

This is one of the reasons (one of the VERY few) that eBay is actually better then Amazon - under $750 you only need Delivery Confirmation and a DELIVERED notification from USPS (website) as proof.

Da_m it - I had to praise eBay for something ..... the world must be comming to an end

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

This user has validated their user name. by: Marie

Wed Jun 15 12:58:46 2022

@UB

You are correct, I did purchase my shipping labels through Amazon, but why would the coverage be different if I purchased the label elsewhere.  As long as I uploaded the tracking on the transaction right away.

So I'm unsure as to why this makes a difference.

I've been selling on Amz for many years, this is the first time I've ever had this happen.  So I'm confused.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

This user has validated their user name. by: Marie

Wed Jun 15 14:12:39 2022

@Rexford

Since this is the first time I've ever had this happen, I would be cutting a meaningful  $$'s of income over one transaction.  IMHO that would not benefit me in any way and would certainly damage me financially.

I just need to understand why this happened so I can avoid it for the future, but Amz absolutely will not tell me any details.  Which makes no sense at all.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: WalmartClassAction This user has validated their user name.

Wed Jun 15 14:23:22 2022

@Marie, I would definitely appeal and quote their own "Buy Shipping" policy in your appeal. As I'm sure you're aware, Amazon reps are pretty horrible and most of the time don't even know their own policies so I definitely wouldn't let this go.  

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

This user has validated their user name. by: Marie

Thu Jun 16 02:30:44 2022

I really appreciate @WalmartClassAction all the info you have proved.  I appealed and quoted all kinds of things, I emailed them threw the Case Log and I have called.  They simply refuse to change what they have done and they refuse to tell me why or what has changed so that they are now ignoring electronic tracking.

That is exactly what I said to the last person I tried to talk to at Amz.  I thought it is ridiculous that she did not know the rule and refuses to tell me where to look for the change that has apparently happened.

But something you said earlier I need a little clarification on.  You have made some comments about purchasing your shipping On Amazon, which I do most of the time.  But sometimes for my post popular item, Amz does not give me access to FC package which is how it ships, so I have to go off site to purchase the shipping.  Once I do that I immediately come back to Amz and load the tracking number to the sales order.

It is very odd that they are inconsistent on the methods of shipment offered.  I haven't changed my listing but there will be a handful of orders per week that I need to purchase the shipping off Amz, but again I come back and update the sale with the tracking number right away.

On Tuesday I had a sale on this product and the appropriate shipping options were available, so easy enough, I purchased the shipping in Amz.  Then I got another order for the same product less that a hour after that one and the available shipping methods were only Priority Mail which is not correct.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: UB This user has validated their user name.

Thu Jun 16 03:24:04 2022

@Marie I would create a post on the Amazon seller forum and explain what happened and ask for help from an Amazon Moderator.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: Zarzuella This user has validated their user name.

Thu Jun 16 04:20:59 2022

This has been Amazon policy for a long time now;  you have been lucky if you have not bumped into it until now, given how well Amazon has trained buyers to falsely claim INR.
Buy Shipping Policy is well defined, and if you meet the criteria and have been denied on A_Z claim you should appeal citing policy.  Note that your shipment must have been scanned as shipped by the 'ship by' date to qualify. This is often the problem, as the PO can occasionally move your package through the system without initial scans.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: Zarzuella This user has validated their user name.

Thu Jun 16 04:22:12 2022

Link to policy:  https://sellercentral.amazon.com/help/hub/reference/G200202220R>

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: stevel This user has validated their user name.

Thu Jun 16 06:41:02 2022

I would use the Account Health Dpt, since an a-z was filed, it affects your seller status. Acct Health will call you and I have found them very helpful. I would expect Amazon would eat the cost.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: Chicago48 This user has validated their user name.

Thu Jun 16 08:11:09 2022

Get signature confirmation on all orders.  Pass the shipping cost to the buyer.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: railady This user has validated their user name.

Thu Jun 16 08:36:27 2022

@Marie, I am so sorry that this is happening to you - you have given me some absolutely terrific advice and suggestions here !! I can't be any help because I don't sell on Amazon, but I wish you absolutely the best luck and getting a positive resolution.

I do have to say that, golly, tracking is involved? Looks to me like just a new twist on the same old game of DoSuSe ''DontSupportSeller'' ! Probably 8 years or so ago a friend decided to start selling books on Amazon. Her very first sale - woohoo !! But then, Buyer decided he didn't like the book, complained to AZ (NOTE, he confirmed to AZ he actually got the book - no 'tracking' involved) so AZ told him to keep the book AND refunded his payment out of my friend's account!!  So there was my friend, stuck without EITHER her money or the book returned so she could resell it ...  no more Amazon for her.  

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: fusgeyer This user has validated their user name.

Thu Jun 16 10:26:55 2022

It is unfortunate that Amazon is requiring you to refund the customer. I would contact the customer and require them to provide me a copy of the police report for the stolen package. If they have not filed one, require them to do so in order for them to get the refund.

If the item was shipped through the US Post Office, stealing of mail or tampering with the mail is a federal felony. The buyer will need to file a report of stolen mail with the USPS. Require them to send you a copy of the report. If the shipper was not the US Postal Service, you still need a police report to verify the stolen merchandise claim.

If it is a legit claim for a stolen package, most buyers will gladly comply. If it is not legit, expect strong pushback on filing a report.

Change your listings to state that all shipments require a signature. It will delay the delivery if they are not home, but it will deter some of your more shady characters.

Perminate Link for Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D   Amazon Refunds Buyers Even though Tracking Shows D

by: myfriendhenry This user has validated their user name.

Thu Jun 16 10:35:39 2022

just order another Kindle and file an INR.  You have to fight them with their own policies.  they KNOW this is an issue and they don't care.  even though they claim to be GREEN, the 10% RETURNS issue never get fixed.  Imagine the carbon footprint of all this fraud.  On eBay I do not have these issues.

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