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Mon June 1 2015 21:41:48

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Against Bad Buyer

By: Reader

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Dear Ina,
I have been selling on eBay for about 10 years. I use their option to not take returns which they seem to no longer honor. 

I recently sold an item for $130 and shipped it. The buyer had something like it - not as good or complete. He sold his and then had eBay give him my money back. 

eBay has been no help dealing with this buyer scam. They blew off the San Jose BBB complaint. They removed funds from my PayPal account leaving a negative balance. 

Anything I might sell will be basically given away in the future. I have found a number of on-line complaints that seem to be basically the same. 

In the past few months eBay has been no help when called - one person even told me they would get fired if they helped me. Months ago this was never an issue getting help from their reps. 
G.




Comments (51) | Permalink

Readers Comments

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

This user has validated their user name. by: Philip Cohen
Web Site

Mon Jun 1 21:52:34 2015

So, what's new today at eBay—the most unscrupulous commercial entity on the planet?

The eBay executive suite—where the incompetent mingle with the disingenuous, the malevolent and the outright criminal, and the just plain stupid … http://bit.ly/11F2eas  

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: 1beck3 This user has validated their user name.

Mon Jun 1 21:55:40 2015

As always, Philip offers nothing to further the conversation.  Well done!

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

This user has validated their user name. by: Philip Cohen
Web Site

Mon Jun 1 21:57:12 2015

The only way a seller can get any satisfaction in such circumstances is to complain to a media outlet that takes on such matters—the one thing that eBay does not like is such instances of their atrocious customer support being reported in a major media outlet ...

The eBay executive suite—where the incompetent mingle with the disingenuous, the malevolent and the outright criminal, and the just plain stupid … http://bit.ly/11F2eas  

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

This user has validated their user name. by: Philip Cohen
Web Site

Mon Jun 1 22:06:43 2015

@1beck3,

And your contribution is any better?

The eBay executive suite—where the incompetent mingle with the disingenuous, the malevolent and the outright criminal, and the just plain stupid … http://bit.ly/11F2eas  

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

This user has validated their user name. by: iheartjacksparrow

Mon Jun 1 22:41:11 2015

@G (OP) - There's only one person/entity that sets rules on eBay: eBay. A SNAD claim overrides any policies you have in place. And I agree with Philip. eBay hates negative publicity. Do you have a local television station that has a "consumer watchdog" segment? Or perhaps a local newspaper what will interview you and feature a story about your experience? We've read on this site before about how eBay will overturn a previous ruling once one of their unconscionable decisions is widely reported. eBay certainly doesn't want their onerous anti-seller policies to become public knowledge. That wouldn't help to replenish their dwindling seller base.  

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 2 00:06:39 2015

Sparrow is %100 correct. Having a "No Returns" policy means nothing.

eBays MBG policy is a license to steal - and one that is done with eBays blessings and with impunity.

Its not just a NO RETURNS policy, is a 14 policy, any type of restocking fee, AND eBay no longer folls its own rules for an items return.

eBays own policy is quite clear - "You must return an item in the same condition as it was received, not used or altered in any way. You must also include, in the same condition as it was received"

When I asked about that, I was told "be happy he didnt send you back a box of rocks".

eBay also mandates "You must also include:

1) All original packaging such as boxes, bags, tags, and UPCs

2) Accessories such as cords and remote controls

3)Certificates, manuals, and warranty cards  

When I receive back items missing parts or switched, eBay tells me to take the loss, since losses are GOOD for you... unless you own them fees and then losses are NOT a good thing (when its eBays pocket).

Sellers are a conduit to funnel money from Buyers (its the only group of people left that eBay can hope to grow their business after pissing off almost every OTHER group) to themselves.

Its so easy to STEAL from sellers, and eBay employees are of NO HELP.

They are monitored HEAVILY. If they deviate from the script then they get punished. They loose pay, benefits and promotions.

"Stick to the script and stick it to the seller" is eBays motto.

But, sellers are wising up and leaving for Amazon like a herd of stampeding cattle - all while eBay brass sit and watch Rome burn.

eBay has plenty of cash though. We will STILL be having this conversation 2 yrs from now.

As long as there are naive sellers to steal from - people who believe that you can sell on eBay and succeed, there will always be "new blood" for eBay to steal from.

There is no policy against unethical, illegal eBay returns policy, just as there is no Seller Protection, no Yeti, no Loch Ness monster, and no shovel ready jobs ... the jury is still out on the Easter bunny and Santa :)

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: BigQ This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 2 00:41:06 2015

You take 30 minutes to write a message included all details and evidences to report a buyer, but eBay so-called customer service only take 3 seconds to send you a template message.

They never tried to help you, even they do, it's really lack of logicality of them, I think the only logicality when they resolve the report is "Buyer first, even he seems like a scammer"

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: Moonwishes This user has validated their user name.
Web Site

Tue Jun 2 01:39:44 2015

>> recently sold an item for $130 and shipped it. The buyer had something like it - not as good or complete. He sold his and then had eBay give him my money back.<<

I'm a bit lost here. What does him having something like what you sent that he sells have anything to do with you losing your money via ebay? Your post  makes no sense.


eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: sasikat9 This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 2 05:53:10 2015

Wake up people....If you can't afford to lose it.....Then don't sell on Ebay.

How many times does Ebay have to smack you on the head with a ball bat before you finally realize EBAY HATES YOU AND WILL DO ANYTHING IT CAN TO PROVE IT.

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: hopeforthebest This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 2 06:36:19 2015

Never try to sell anything on Ebay that you can't afford to lose.

You're always at risk of losing your product, your money, and your sense of justice.  

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

This user has validated their user name. by: Rexford

Tue Jun 2 07:12:22 2015

My question is this---is eBay guardrailing sellers who have a no-return policy, but who fight these returns and actually win their cases?  Each time that we have fought back against a "liar buyer" forced return we have won, but we notice that after the fact, we sales plummet.   Does eBay punish sellers for not taking a return even when the seller is right, and eBay agrees that the seller is right?

Nothing this company does surprises me.  Ric called them "ethically challenged".  I say that they are rotten to the core.  For the life of me I don't know why the management of this company haven't been hauled off to prison.

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: ajeweler This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 2 08:52:43 2015

ebay is over engineered then they fixed that once again, in addition they will beat you one way or the other until the blood does not flow any longer they do not just want part of your money the greedy people want all your money!!! no policy covers returns except ebay way, in addition there is no seller protection at all I cannot believe there are still sellers there????????

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: ebay refugee camp This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 2 09:03:45 2015

Ebay has a 100 percent buyer guarantee, ebay will rule against the seller so they do not have to pay the buyer.

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: Santini This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 2 09:23:23 2015

Like moonwishes, I don't understand the OP either...Is he trying to say the buyer returned an incomplete not as good item? Clarification, please.

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: KennyK This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 2 09:26:52 2015

I laugh at random posts like this.  Some buyers are theives, unethical scum.  Either accept it or shut up. As one poster said, if you cant afford a 100% loss, then dont list it...duh...A small percentage are thieves.  If the math of your business does not allow you to aborb an occational loss, then stop selling on ebay.  Hey poster, so you have been selling on ebay for 10 years?  If one sale is that big a deal, then why are you still selling there?  Ebay policies, while ''unfair'', are exactly logical.  They want the seller, with an irrational coplaint, to blame the seller, not ebay.  Its just business, nothing personal against an individual seller.  Why some of you take it personally is beyond me.  What do you think a physical retail store does?  They accept all returns.  They would rather take the loss, than have the customer badmouth them to everyone they know. Yes, I know the thieves get lumpted together with the stupid, buts thats life / business.  (last post i will make on all these anecdotal idiotic posts).

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: moonmyst This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 2 10:27:52 2015

Wow, KennyK could not have said it any better! I have been subscribed to this newsletter for about two years now, and the same people are still on here posting the same complaints against eBay. Bottom line, there are scammer SELLERS as well as buyers -- that is the way business is.  If you don't like it, then stop selling. Geeesh!  On the flip side, if you were to buy something on Bonanza, you would find they totally side with the seller and the buyer gets screwed.  So maybe all you eBay bashers should switch over to Bonanaza and then we wouldn't have to listen to the likes of JackSparrow, Pace306 & PhilipCohen anymore.  These guys need to get out of the rut they're in and get a life.

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

This user has validated their user name. by: Basset

Tue Jun 2 11:05:46 2015


In practice, there never has been a ''no returns'' defense. SNAD always has taken precedence.  

For my main account, adding a returns policy reduced SNAD to all but nil.  

A second account has heavier items and I now have a ''no returns'' policy. I would still offer returns on that one, but not if I can't deduct original shipping cost from the refund.  At one time I could, but then ''returns'' procedure kept changing and changing so I gave up and went to ''no returns''.  


But SNAD and ''item not delivered'' are ALWAYS a part of the equation for sellers and have been for years. If these occur, the probability of a refund and loss of shipping costs seller paid are high.

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: ebaighsucks This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 2 11:10:05 2015

This has happened to me twice. Both times I filed complaints with the attorney generals' office in my state as well as California and Utah.
Both times paypal refunded my money as a so called courtesy.

If it happens again, I'll file another complaint.

As far as the BBB, this is a business that eBay pays to belong to.

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: a_c_green This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 2 11:15:08 2015

> Like moonwishes, I don't understand the OP either...
> Is he trying to say the buyer returned an incomplete not as good item?
> Clarification, please.

Agreed, more details on the exact sequence of events would be helpful here. Otherwise all the comments will just be the generic eBay-is-evil assortment, as seen.

eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag   eBay Seller Says No-Return Policy Is No Defense Ag

by: Maui5150 This user has validated their user name.

Tue Jun 2 11:28:48 2015

The solution is EASY.  Ebay needs to be sued and REQUIRED to use an INDEPENDENT ARBITOR for all complaints and claims.

Right now sales are WAY DOWN.  I have seen my year to year sales drop, as well as that as many others.  I have also seen a large increase of tire kickers, to the point were I have had persons make offers on items I have accepted and then had to file Non-Paying Bidders.  It is one thing to have buyers regret after being bought up, but one of the reasons I accepted one of these low-ball offers is I had a feeling the person would back out.  My guess is they wanted to see how low I would counter to try and gauge value.

Simply put, the only thing eBay still has going for it is number of daily visitors and views, but that is decreasing and the quality of buyers falling even faster.

eBay has a VESTED interest to side with the buyers since that is the only thing they have keeping them afloat, even though the sellers are the ones paying all the costs.  

This bias is a clear conflict, to the point where eBay allows or encourages fraud.  In cases where they have acted as a agent of fraud, they should be held accountable for the loss as well as damages.  i.e. if a reasonable person would know that fraud was being committed and they were the instrument of allowing that fraud, then they should legally be liable.  

You want to see changes... Have eBay required to pay for arbitration when a seller appeals, especially in the case where they suspect fraud, bait and switch, etc. and allow data on those claims to be aggregated and published.

Since eBay is able to keep the details and numbers hidden, they can brush the fraud under the table.  If an independent arbitor publishes that 90% of seller appeals to them are reversed and eBay was substantially negligent, that will be embarrassment and incentive to get it right the first time.  

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