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Sat Oct 24 2015 16:19:29

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud?

By: Reader

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Dear Ina,
We are writing this to advise sellers of a very critical unannounced change eBay made that has now taken effect.

Historically, whether through Hassle Free Returns, a Protection Case or a Return Request, eBay would require a buyer to return an item in its original condition. If it was not, a seller was able to dispute it, escalate it or appeal it with evidence that the item was not the original item sent out or altered from its original condition. Then eBay would protect the Seller through Seller Protection. 

As of now, that protection is verified with Top Team Leadership at eBay to be gone. 

What does this mean? It means a buyer could purchase a $600.00 iPhone and return a potato. eBay would cite it as a "Faulty Return" and force seller reimbursement. An appeal would not be granted, as we learned the hard way.

Similarly, maybe a pair of New Sunglasses sold, could be returned cracked in half, and eBay will force a seller refund.

There will be no more "courtesy" seller refunds either.

We are now beginning talks with an Atty for a Class Action Suit. How can eBay facilitate fraud so easily?
C.




Comments (47) | Permalink

Readers Comments

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

This user has validated their user name. by: Basset

Sat Oct 24 17:25:39 2015

No comfort level selling high-end items on eBay - haven't done so for a while.


Sadly, don't sell things you can't afford to lose.  

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

This user has validated their user name. by: iheartjacksparrow

Sat Oct 24 19:17:47 2015

Basset is 100% correct. Don't sell anything on eBay in a high-risk category, and don't sell anything that you can afford to have stolen. Unfortunately, the "liar buyers" know it's easy to get free stuff from eBay since eBay has been facilitating theft for years.  

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

This user has validated their user name. by: iheartjacksparrow

Sat Oct 24 19:22:20 2015

And it's a sad commentary on the state of eBay that getting ripped off is the norm and not the exception.

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

by: fashionista This user has validated their user name.

Sat Oct 24 20:51:58 2015

this is not new, it has been happening a few years. the exact quote I think was "I invited the return (because I have a return policy) and they can not verify how I shipped it, so IT'S THE COST OF DOING BUSINESS"  I actually quoted cs the phone example, and they said, you have to accept the return, same with a new with tags dress, returned full of spaghetti sauce stains, same thing."
So I don't do any very expensive items.

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Sat Oct 24 21:42:47 2015

eBay expects sellers to eat all losses they absolutely do not care what a buyer does or returns.

eBay facilitates the fraud since they gain from the return each and every time while the seller always looses.

eBay says sellers should take random arbitrary losses since ''it's part of doing business''.

Of course it's fraud on ebays part since the forced returns are good for eBay - good customer PR as well as profit on the USPS label and the sale of that label visa PayPal.

eBay puts all the onus on sellers and reps the all the benefits.  

Even a no returns policy doesn't help since all a buyer has to say is SNAD me!

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

This user has validated their user name. by: toolguy

Sun Oct 25 09:44:24 2015

I sold a micrometer set last month for $1775 and I have to admit I was nervous for 2 weeks after the sale.

I just hope it's not out there on a 60 day rental. . .

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

This user has validated their user name. by: iheartjacksparrow

Sun Oct 25 10:52:46 2015

@toolguy - If your buyer paid with PayPal, they have an 180-rental period.

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

This user has validated their user name. by: Ric

Sun Oct 25 11:26:30 2015

With the fall seller update being mostly seller positive, sellers were lulled into a false sense of security that the post split eBay management team was going to become more seller friendly.

Unfortunately, that appears not to be the case given this unannounced change.

Some questions for eBay....

Has the corporate policy with regard to seller facing policy changes being announced in advance and only twice a year been discontinued?

Is eBay now going to impose drastic policy changes without any notice and allow sellers to be informed only after the policy sangs them in the eBay policy snare?

Is management capable of comprehending that the liberal return policy already in place has resulted in diminished sales as many sellers have decided not to risk their high ticket priced items on eBay?

Is management capable of comprehending that the removal of many high ticket items causes buyers to be unable to find items they may well be seeking which would increase eBay's GMV if/when those items sold?

We have not purchased any new inventory for sale on eBay in over a year and have no plans to do so going forward.

PayPal's 180 day use and return policy is unacceptable, and now, eBay's return anything for a full refund policy makes selling using either of these 2 services a zero sum game for sellers.

Just when you think policies could not become any more anti-seller, eBay decides to ratchet up the pressure even higher and fails to inform sellers of the shift in policy.

Given eBay and PayPal's anti-seller policies, our goal is to sell off our remaining inventory and cease selling entirely sometime in 2016.

Removing the stress of dealing with eBay and their unannounced policy changes and PayPal with their unrealistic 180 day return policy will add years to our life.

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

This user has validated their user name. by: Anonymous Annie

Sun Oct 25 11:54:45 2015

If eBay is refusing to eat the costs of fraudulent returns, is that eBay's way of acknowledging there's a problem?

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

by: RLS This user has validated their user name.

Sun Oct 25 12:02:15 2015

I verified this myself a few minutes ago. I used the phrase "open season on sellers" and the ebay rep agreed with my assessment. They will no longer protect sellers from unscrupulous buyers. It is simply the cost of business. We can report the buyer but no refunds will be issued. Furthermore their is no way to know if a buyer has done this in the past. Sellers are operating on the hope and pray .One can only hope that in the future that ebay realizes that  the seller (the one paying fees) is their customer and the person buying from me is my customer. As for me I have has a website for a while but have not devoted the time and resources to it. That changes now. When your business partner takes 8-10% off the top and has had as many problems as ebay has had in the past they lose what remaining loyalty and goodwill that may have existed. Their is an old adage in business that you can never win an argument with a client. Ebay would do well to remember that.

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

This user has validated their user name. by: Basset

Sun Oct 25 12:04:08 2015


A venue that wanted fair resolution to issues might try:

Provide a communication method, returns tool, and arbitration platform for sellers to use, then butt out.  

Buyer and Seller can't resolve?  Provide arbitration by those with at least 3-5 year selling AND buying experience - could be teams of 3 working together from their homes, paid per number of decisions rendered.  

Set up an arbitration platform where all evidence and facts are submitted by both sides. Assigned a case number and a team. Team accesses, reviews, consults each other, decides and returns outcome to Venue.  

Confidential account info would be held by the Venue, who would ''enforce'' the decision through proper notifications and any refund if called for.  

Buyers and Sellers would have a ''jury'' of their peers.

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

by: sasikat9 This user has validated their user name.

Sun Oct 25 18:53:06 2015

@ Basset

To much kool aid you been drinking. There isn't a venue in the world that would even attempt anything like your bucket list.

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

This user has validated their user name. by: Basset

Sun Oct 25 20:08:06 2015


One can dream, can't one, Sasicat?

Don't drink kool-aid - never liked the stuff, not even in purple passion.(the version with grape Kool-aid and Everclear).  

Once is enough - from what I can remember.

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

This user has validated their user name. by: Ric

Sun Oct 25 21:38:01 2015

@Annie asks: "If eBay is refusing to eat the costs of fraudulent returns, is that eBay's way of acknowledging there's a problem?"

eBay operates under the misconception that ultra liberal return policies, including condoning the criminal acts of those who commit mail fraud will bring more buyers to the marketplace.  They simply refuse to realize that to date, existing liberal return policies have done nothing to increase sales.

With eBay all but insisting buyers return virtually every purchase, and with eBay now walking away from any semblance of support for sellers against buyer fraud look at where we are at....

One, eBay profits from the return process, and as such does not care if their enslaved sellers lose money, so the pocket picking will continue.

Two, eBay can no longer tolerate the high costs these liar buyers have have on reducing the corporate bottom line. Now, as usual for eBay management, they are sticking their collective heads further up their rear ends and essentially denying the problem exists for their own corporate advantage.

Three, eBay does not have the stomach for dealing with liar buyers they created in a direct manner and now refuses to foot the bill when their monsters defraud sellers.

As usual, eBay is happier shifting the losses to their sellers and then they why sellers are walking away in droves.

This company is criminally mismanaged to the point they will eventually implode under their many gross miscalculations.


eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

by: joecharlie This user has validated their user name.

Sun Oct 25 22:04:33 2015

I got scammed with a chargeback the guy kept the item and cancelled payment with the credit card it was a 25 dollar piece.

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Sun Oct 25 23:07:10 2015

All this started in Sept when they changed the Returns policy procedures.

In that change, eBay adsolved themselves of ANY responsibility .... for really ... almost anything - but in this case RETURNS of any kind/

Sellers are responsible to insure that buyers are happy with the items they bought PERIOD.

NOTHING else matters. eBay knows quite well about the lies, theft and fraud - its boards are FULL of horror stories with sellers being stolen from.

eBAy OPENLY tells you that "its ok if a buyer sends back a rock". When a return happens - all eBay does is FORCE it - the rest - good or bad is the sellers problem.

eBay is SO desperate for buyers that they let them do ANYTHING.

They know quite well, they can read the emails back n forth. They know (or should know) what a NEW item looks like and how it is packed.

eBay is a bigger criminal organization then the Mafia, the Yakuza and the Triads - all put together.

(eBay I DARE you to come try and sue me for slander)

eBay voids its own item condition page in the returns section claiming "what we gave you, we can take away".

Its the cost of doing business - thats they lie they tell you.

When you try and return an item to Macys - they get to look at it FIRST before deciding what to do. They arent bound by ANYTHING to give you a refund for an empty box, an item missing parts or another item that you didnt buy.

Yet, eBay decided that THEY have that authority ... over you and they are "JUST A VENUE".

Of course you can always "report the buyer" ... such hogwash - do they REALLY think that theres anyone (maybe except tool guy) who believes that reporting anything to eBay actually does something? It doesnt, it never did and it never will.

eBay lies, cheats and steals - and as long as you dont drink the Kool Aide - you know that.

Thats why most manufactorers, magazines and large sellers - simply ignore or walk (sorry RUN) away from eBay.

Just as the scumbags at Skullcandy - the ones who cut a deal with eBays VERO Dept to cull 3p sellers of Skullcandy headphones.

The cull went well, the Platinum store went up ... the sales SKY ROCKETED (no competition) and then the complaints, negatives and back end games began.

See Skullcandy couldnt get rid of ALL the 3p sellers - even though eBay promised it would. People like me threatened eBay with a law suit ... and there were more people then just little old me.

Yes Skullcandy got a few hundred thousand feedbacks - but thats not what they wanted - they wanted eBY to rid itself of ALL those sellers - and eBay balked.

The traffic (as RIC and Ming have said over and over) ended up being moved to Skullcandys OWN website - they simply used eBay to data mine.

Those 2 fine gentlemen said it about others (they never mentioned Skullcandy directly to my knowledge) pointed out time and time again how the large manufactorers who USE eBay then spit them out .... and then WW3 erupted.

eBay accused Skullcandy of hijacking sales and buyers, Skullcandy accused eBay of not cracking down hard enough on 3p sellers of thier products, eBay accused them of not providing the traffic on eBay that they promised, and Skullcandy then said - NO MORE back end funds.

And poof - there goes ANOTHER manufacturer who now HATES eBay.

The point - eBay will do ANYTHING - even to "their won" as long as it benfits them.

eBay is a necessary evil and nothing more.

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

by: salukisal This user has validated their user name.

Mon Oct 26 00:18:57 2015

So what else is new?  You would only expect EBay to get worse with its' treatment of sellers, never better.  C'mon, it's EBay!  Bandits, Tramps, and Thieves.

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

by: comet This user has validated their user name.

Mon Oct 26 00:44:00 2015

Why are none of us SURRISED at this?  Even if we have not experienced it yet ourselves?

This is the SAME company that changed my ship-to address and then DEMANDED that I file a CASE against the seller who unwittingly sent the item I bought to the wrong address.  So--this was EBAY'S FAULT--and they want ME to TRASH a seller who did nothing WRONG.

(In this case I was the buyer--and they did cover my cost using ebay Bucks--so remember this is a possible option BUT you probably have to get a US CSR and be very convincing--and it might not worl for a seller)  

They are criminals aiding and abetting theft--and like PACE306 ---I dare them to prove me wrong.    

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

by: pixie dust This user has validated their user name.

Mon Oct 26 01:13:42 2015

The new ''letgo'' site claims to have 100 mill ready to tackle ebay (and ding amazon) but checking their site today, I noticed their current home page was pic gallery a la itsy & rubylane. So, I sent them a comm relating that this BS won't cut it, and they need to copy the best of ebay while nixing the worst. I'm clueless why so few alternate sites have a category listing table upfront (like ebay) so buyers can navigate the site vs simply surf. I told letgo to contact long time ebay users for input, but they probably think they know best. Time will tell - regards, pixie dust

eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud   eBay No Longer Protects Sellers from Returns Fraud

This user has validated their user name. by: LasVagueness

Mon Oct 26 01:22:12 2015

Love your idea @basset!!  

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