Ina Steiner EcommerceBytes Blog
News and insight focusing on ecommerce.
by Ina Steiner, Editor of EcommerceBytes.com
Thu Sept 27 2018 21:09:19

Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

By: Ina Steiner

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eBay began rolling out managed payments (MP) on Monday, and on Wednesday, it made significant changes to its terms of use for the program, something participants should be sure to scrutinize.

A seller published screenshots of the terms from September 25, which included a paragraph explaining how to opt out of the program. However, the terms currently on the eBay website do not include that paragraph.

The seller advised colleagues they could use the screenshot taken on Tuesday "as proof that the initial terms to which you agreed allowed you to opt out."*

It calls to mind eBay CEO Devin Wenig's tough tone when discussing managed payments in February: "It will (eventually) be the only way you can transact on eBay. It's not going to be optional. We're not going to hold peoples' hands and beg them to move over. We're basically going to say your eBay account is now your full end-to-end eBay account for all your activities including payments. And that's the way it works on every other marketplace."

The terms, found on this page, also show "eBay Commerce Inc." is acting as an agent for sellers when it collects payments from buyers rather than acting as the merchant of record.*** "The contract for sale underlying the purchase of goods is directly concluded between the seller and the buyer."

But once a buyer has paid eBay for a seller's item, that seller cannot go after the buyer if eBay doesn't disburse the seller for that purchase. "In the event that eBay Commerce does not make any such payment to you as described in these Payments Terms of Use, you will have recourse against only eBay Commerce and not against the buyer, as such payment is deemed made by the buyer to you upon receipt by eBay Commerce."

The terms of use spell out that sellers agree that eBay may reduce the amount of settlements "in the amount of obligations owed by you to eBay Commerce or its affiliates, subject to these Payments Terms of Use."

We advise participating sellers to read "Authorization to Pay eBay Commerce" in Section 5 especially carefully. It outlines ways it may collect owed amounts from sellers, including "Retaining such amounts from your current or future settlements."

However, the terms also state, "For clarity, eBay will continue to charge the automatic payment method you placed on file for payment of your monthly invoice."

eBay terms state it anticipates settlements will be settled in sellers' bank accounts approximately two to seven business days after the buyer's transaction and also grants itself permission to place holds on sellers' funds.

eBay advises sellers participating in the initial launch of managed payments that they cannot list items using eBay for Charity, international sites or through International Site Visibility, and the Global Shipping program and eBay Authenticate. 

A seller informed us that some categories are off-limits as well, as he learned on Tuesday, though that is not spelled out in the terms. The list the seller forwarded, which we have yet to confirm, included: Coins & Paper Money; Adults Only; Gun Parts; Tobacciana; Breweriana; E-Cigarettes, Vapes & Accs; and Metaphysical.

Under fees, the terms state eBay charges 2.7% percent of the total amount owed to the seller, including shipping, handling, sales tax and other amounts owed and that it will charge a $20 chargeback fee.

The terms reference in passing Form 1099K. Sellers should note that payment processors are obligated to file Form 1099K with the IRS and some state departments of revenue for sellers meeting certain thresholds.

Be sure to read the terms carefully and stay alert for other unannounced changes.

*Update 9/27/18: I came across a thread this evening started by a panicked seller whose sales have plummeted since being enrolled on Monday, and says they are unable to opt out. That's is very troubling indeed. (Seller was getting 30% of sales internationally, which is not allowed through managed payments, and reports getting emails from buyers asking why they can't pay with PayPal - also not allowed with managed payments.)

At least one of the sellers responding to the thread who also reported a sales drop as a result of being enrolled in managed payments on Monday reported they *were* able to opt out after repeated calls to eBay. 

However, the fact that two days after rolling out the program and getting complaints about plummeting sales eBay would change its terms to eliminate the ability to opt out of the program is chilling.

***Update 9/28/18: Readers debated below whether eBay was or will be the merchant of record as it rolls out managed payments. We looked again at the terms of use and are not sure. In January, eBay's CFO said eBay hadn't made a decision and said it might change "depending on the geography in which we operate." We don't see any subsequent reference to the matter, and don't know what the implications are to sellers of eBay being or not being the "merchant of record." (Thanks for raising the question!)

One thing we can say with 100% certainty: certain Wall Street analysts are very interested in the payments transition. We're not sure if eBay executives will update sellers, but we do expect them to address the transition during its next earnings call with analysts in a few weeks.



Comments (187) | Leave Comment | Permalink

Readers Comments

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Thu Sep 27 21:31:51 2018

1) eBay AGAIN grants itself virtually UNLIMITED power when it comes to payments. From its past behaviors, its known that eBay is NOT the sellers advocate and honesty is a commodity absent form eBays lexicon.

In english - eBay will rob you blind every moment they can. They lie cheat and steal whenever possible. eBay denies you your rights, due process, the rights to appeal any and all verdicts - in otherwords - when you make a deal with the DEVIL (DEVIN) - at some point he will come for your SOUL.

2) eBay changed the wording on who was the MERCHANT OF RECORD (as I stated in the past)(due to whom exactly would be responsible for the taxes on each sale). Note that eBay wrote "Under fees, the terms state eBay charges 2.7% percent of the total amount owed to the seller, including shipping, handling, ***** sales tax **** and other amounts owed and that it will charge a $20 chargeback fee."

3) eBay has again made it (or claims that you cant) go after the buyer if theres an issue - you still can - its called SMALL CLAIMS COURT. "you will have recourse against only eBay Commerce and not against the buyer, as such payment is deemed made by the buyer to you upon receipt by eBay Commerce." They can claim what they want - but thats NOT legal and they know it. Its a scare tactic. They know however that Adyen (the Norwegian dorks) will punt the ball and claim that ONLY EBAY can make changes to any agreements or decide any issues. Hence the $20 chargeback fee that they KNOW you will do with your bank.

4) "eBay terms state it anticipates settlements will be settled in sellers' bank accounts approximately two to seven business days after the buyer's transaction and also grants itself permission to place holds on sellers' funds." CRIMINALITY all around - once again.  Amazon doesnt do this BTW (to all the Amazon bashers)(well not exactly). 2 days later its in your bank - money is only held if theres an A-Z against you. eBay here, has given itself permission to do what ever it pleases .... PIGS.

Yes 1 day soon all sellers will be forced into this mess, hopefully by then the Devil Devin will have killed the company enough to have changes forced on it.

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: eBay Shill Buster This user has validated their user name.

Thu Sep 27 21:47:28 2018

Devin Wenig is going to be fired before he converts all eBay sellers over to eBay Payments, it is a sure thing now.

eBay does not want to be merchant of record because they want to dodge the collection of sales tax and the lawsuits that are going to follow, Devin is the dumbest lawyer in the history to the legal profession, he has no idea what he is doing because in his folly the terms of eBay payments keep changing by the day.

Devin's entire replatforming of eBay is a monumental disaster not only for sellers, but for eBay and their shareholders also and the shareholders are the folks who will finally do away with this moron who thinks Seller Hub is a smashing success.  

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: Geetar This user has validated their user name.

Thu Sep 27 21:47:40 2018

HMMM....still have to pay palpal for your monthly ebay invoice!!! Guess they dont want to pay a high transaction fee for processing credit cards! Would have been nice to get some rewards points for paying the invoice. That would have been great.

I am sure after a while that will change. And they will accept credit cards!

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: TomH This user has validated their user name.

Thu Sep 27 21:59:15 2018

Surely no one here is surprised by this. It is totally a statement ''we are only a venue'' BS. A point that will potentially be very troublesome down the road is the including of ''taxes'' in the processing fee. Accept for the fact of selling through eBay or Amazon, I actually would seldom owe any state sales tax under any law on the books and even those recently enacted.......

It is going to all be a mess.

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

This user has validated their user name. by: Ina

Thu Sep 27 23:40:48 2018

Please read update posted shortly after this post was published. The decision to remove the ability to opt out as panicked sellers see plummeting sales (due to no PayPal or international sales allowed) is sickening.

Hoping there is some quick resolution to this mess, coming as holiday sales begin to ramp up.

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: ebayout This user has validated their user name.

Fri Sep 28 00:11:54 2018

There should be a warning before signing up as an ebay seller:
"Caution! Please consult a lawyer (at your expense) before you agree to our terms."

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: ebayisscrewed This user has validated their user name.

Fri Sep 28 00:12:24 2018

This will be the death of eBay as we know it.

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: 1st Armored Div. 1971-1973 This user has validated their user name.

Fri Sep 28 00:15:18 2018

20-30% of my sales are international depending on the time of year and how much I am selling within the USA. it would be devastating to me to lose this business.

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Fri Sep 28 00:22:26 2018

Theres a few things going on here - all brought to you by people motivated by greed, not by logic.

eBay has now switched sides from being a venue (what they claimed in court), to a managed marketplace, back to a venue (now by NOT being Seller Of Record) - and that is where any god lawyer will take eBay apart. Sadly - I doubt it will happen. eBay is FILLED with lawyers (not ecommerce people) and EVERY change is run through the legal machine to insure its lawfulness. Apparently you can change what your company is as many times as you wish - as long as you tell the SEC that.

DW had a great thing handed to him - eBay printed money. At one time eBay had almost 9 BILLION parked offshore - all he had to do was keep on keepin on. BUT, DW (imbecile first class) thought HE (with no experience) could make eBay into Amazon. Didnt work.

He surrounded himself by even more people who knew/know nothing - and the Amazon imitations started.

Keeping the "Sleeping Seller Advocate" aka moron #2 (grifter) was the "kosher" for Sellers and Wall street. "See we have your best intentions at heart - we are on your side". Oh Really?  ..... NOT ONE thing done since 2007 has helped sellers in the long term - NOT ONE.

He just had to pick a fight with Paypal. He just couldnt be happy with the way things were and renegotiate like a human being. So, DW decided to step up his game and become the REAL Tony Soprano. Only thing is, if you know anything about the Jersey mob they were based on - they were incompetent boobs who were laughed at not only by the FBI but by other gangsters as well.

DW said it clearly "he hates the NOISE" aka the smaller sellers. People here ... (AHEM) still swear thats not true. It was true in 2007 and its true in 2018. Large sellers need not follow any rules, and micro sellers sell their items then leave. That leaves us - the hated.

At EVERY juncture, eBay made the wrong choice. Payments is just the latest stupidity.

Not that consolidating payments is dumb - it was HOW it was done. It was done like a "tuchas".

eBay will ram this stupid idea down everyone's mouths - because they can.

Who will stop them?

So they loose a few hundred / thoughsand sellers ... never stopped them before, has it?

Dodging the seller of record business was smart - there was NO WAY they could have pulled it off - too many liabilities (and no BILLIONS left in the kitty to fight them all).

Rule #1 on eBay - its ALWAYS the sellers fault - and if its not - lie and make it so.

Rule #2 - see rule #1 (and and devins a dumb@$$).

Its also about CONTROL. As eBay and Paypal grow farther apart - eBay needs to exert more control over its sellers (like telling them they have no other recourse other then dealing with them) ... its an outright LIE.

As others here have said - no matter WHOM you do business with - but ESPECIALLY the crimelord from San Jose - ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS have  a separate bank account. Empty it every night/day and always leave a ZERO balance (I do this with Paypal too).

One day soon - eBay will have full control over payments and then my dear friends - it will be too late for any pf us - eBay will use payments as a sword to force policy - any one they want  on you.

You WILL do 30 day returns - or instead of getting your funds in 2 days- you will get it in 14 - when we are sure no INRs or SNADs are filed against you. Could be 14, could be 30, could be 60 - theres no end to the madness of king George (wenig).

1) always have a extra bank account
2) put a line in your description thats comprised of just 1 word - Amazons ASIN (eBays Cobol program doesnt know what it is) (but your buyers will)
3) keep records of ALL of your buyers - they are YOURS not eBays
4) Support Paypal and Stripe as much as possible
5) go NO RETURNS until the end
6) tell everyone you know how crooked eBay is
7) NEVER buy commodity items on eBay - it helps them
8) NEVER buy a Deal of the Day on eBay unless you have no other choice
9) NEVER participate in any eBay BETA
10) Use every trick in the book against them - take their %10 off gifts or thier free Bucks or what ever - make them sweat the details!
11) sell on other platforms as not to rely on them
12) put a DEVIN WENIG IS A JERK bumper stick on your car (LOL)

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: eBay Shill Buster This user has validated their user name.

Fri Sep 28 00:24:28 2018

Devin Wenig's complete destruction of eBay is near, the only hope is that the Board of Directors who have their heads in the sand are alerted to this Titanic disaster he calls replatforming.

Devin has created programs that sellers not only hate, but these programs are causing sellers to leave the platform in record numbers, Seller Hub and eBay Payments are programs sellers want nothing to do with, sellers want nothing to do with Devin Wenig either.

When your customers hate the CEO and the product and services he is trying to force on them, they tend to cut spending to the bone.

Sellers need to go on a spending strike now, show eBay that you are not going to put up with Devin's folly any longer, pay for play is the way to go, if eBay does not produce sales, they do not make a dime.

Do not buy value added services from eBay, if they do not produce results, make it so you do not pay them anything, find a way to accomplish this.  

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

This user has validated their user name. by: Lightning

Fri Sep 28 01:13:38 2018

@Pace
So glad you were able to stay on point.....

I think you managed to bring up every festering complaint you have in your back pocket.  Really tiring.  Although maybe you are just consolidating the rants, haven't heard one of late.  Thought you were away on vacation or something.
In order of appearance, we have:
Ebay greed
''Just a venue''
Wenig (one word says it all)
Griff (long gone)
Paypal split
''Seller Noise''
Ebay power and control
60 day funds disbursements (that's new!)
You somehow missed VERO

Sure, it will be slower getting disbursements down the road on eBay, and a few more low hurdles to limp over.  Not a big deal.  The more important ''Present Day Fact'' is that it sometimes takes 26 days to get paid by Amazon, depending on the timing of your sales and their semi-monthly payouts, and somehow we survive such a catastrophe.  

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: eBay Shill Buster This user has validated their user name.

Fri Sep 28 01:33:47 2018

Lightning, you don't get it, if eBay sellers wanted Amazon, we would move to Amazon.

Devin's vision is to make a clone of Amazon, it has already flopped and is backfiring on him because sellers like me have been inspired to move inventory over to Amazon because of Devin's idiotic ideas, eBay Payments and Seller Hub are just two of them, wait until Product Pages are "the only way you will buy on eBay.

Your man is a joke of a CEO and will be fired shortly.  

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: deejae137 This user has validated their user name.

Fri Sep 28 01:46:13 2018

Have a moral compass, if you truly believe in all what you are saying, STOP feeding the monster!!   Stop buying on eBay and selling on eBay!!  Otherwise, you are slitting your own throat and scapegoating eBay.  Yes, I know it’s hard and financially problematic, but continuing to feed the beast and complaining it’s the antichrist is like having your cake and eating it too!   Doesn’t that sound like eBay???  Having it’s cake and eating it too!  Have courage, have a moral compass, be brave and be better than eBay!!  If you continue to feed this monster, you are collaborators of your own misery and demise!

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

This user has validated their user name. by: Lightning

Fri Sep 28 02:20:04 2018

@eBay Shill Buster
Maybe there isn't ANYTHING to ''get''.  It's just reality, it's the way it has become.  It's a rolling train wreck, and Wenig (not MY guy at all) is the crazy engineer, but our efforts are best spent making the best of a bad situation.  My sales, for the most part, are suffering like many others.  I hate all the changes, because eBay has yet to make a change in a positive direction, but companies that don't change die.  It's a tough balancing act.  

Complaining and ranting, slinging mud, etc., instead of offering support, positive suggestions, just brings everyone down.  It's a tough time in general to be in e-commerce, so you have to hunker down.  Having a pity party is the last thing you want to do, but usually the first avenue taken.

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: eBay Shill Buster This user has validated their user name.

Fri Sep 28 02:29:47 2018

Sellers need to take the same approach that Carl Icahn did, dump the eBay Board of Directors who have sat back and watched this idiot CEO who is begging for 'more time to modernize the platform' for the next 21 year to ruin the marketplace for sellers and their customers, now he has lost over 15 Billion dollars in market capitalization for shareholders in the last 6 months alone.

It is time to fire Devin Wenig and replace him with a software engineer CEO the same way Microsoft and Google did.

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: Marie This user has validated their user name.

Fri Sep 28 03:02:53 2018

I certainly don't agree with it but CSRs on the threads were telling people weeks before the launch that once you are opt'd in you can not opt out.

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: wilburnet This user has validated their user name.

Fri Sep 28 04:01:36 2018

@Marie - Thats true - sellers opted in should have been aware of the " rules " so to speak.

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

This user has validated their user name. by: The End

Fri Sep 28 04:13:40 2018

SO glad I don't sell on Ebay.

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: angryllama This user has validated their user name.

Fri Sep 28 04:22:20 2018

To ANYONE who defended this coming TrainWreck. Three Little Words.

Told you so.

Perminate Link for Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now   Sellers: Read Terms of Use for eBay Payments Now

by: angryllama This user has validated their user name.

Fri Sep 28 04:23:45 2018

Old Saw is that for all problems there are three choices.  The RIGHT way, the WRONG way and ... the ARMY way.   Substitute EBAY for ARMY.

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