eBay Coin Seller Unnerved by Managed Payments Policy

by: AngrySeller

Canbrit,

You are to be commended on figuring out a way to increase your sales without promoted listings. I don't think people are deaf. I think it is just that they realize that all victories on e-Bay are short lived and 99% of those gurus on Youtube are full of it.

Here's the thing. There is more to building a successful, viable and SALEABLE business than selling product. If all you ever do is sell product, you might be able to make a living, but you will never have a business you can sell that has any value. I'm a Chartered Accountant by profession, and I can tell you that every one of my clients that had a business that was successful counted on the eventual sale of that business to be their nest egg.

To build that type of business you must have repreat customers. Real customers, which are defined as people who prefer to do business with you because they like your value proposition. This is as opposed to buyers. Buyers have no loyalty and do not value any brand. Goods to them are mere commodities. They are fickle, picky and transient. Your income from these people will evaporate the minute you stop competing solely on price.

This is why e-Bay and other online marketplaces are a waste of time, from this perspective: because they really are just jobs - jobs in which you bear ALL of the financial risk, and in which you reap NONE of the long term benefits. You might get short-term benefits when you figure out how to game the system, for a while. But I guarantee you it won't last, which I suspect is why your advice is not being heeded by very many. That, and people are probably way too busy jumping through all the other hoops to start mucking around with listings they already put the work into posting.  

by: CanBrit

@AngrySeller

I'm not trying to build a saleable business. I have had my career, enjoyed it and retired. The money is spending money for me, nothing else. The last two months I have made more each month than I did in my professional life and I thought I was paid extremely well back then with excellent benefits that still continue.

by: CanBrit

@AngrySeller

Further to your response, what if all someone wants is a job? Haven't you seen the senior greeters at Walmart, or the 70 year old part timer at Home Depot. For some, this is like having a flea market stall without getting cold in the winter.

As for myself, I have over 500 repeat customers. I have their email addresses, physical addresses and many phone numbers. I am planning on opening my own Shopify store then selling my eBay business.

All of this is just for fun.  

by: AngrySeller

Canbrit,

Congratulations. You obviously have it all figured out. But you very clearly do not represent the average professional seller on e-Bay. You've said it yourself:

1. You are retired, so you don't need the money.
2. You very well paid on your past professional life, so that supports the above notion.
3. It's just for fun according to you.

There are a very large number of people on these platforms who ARE trying to build businesses and who cannot afford to fail. People with employees, people with bank loans and so on. I was one of those people. I left a $150K a year job to follow my dream of becoming a professional stamp dealer - a dream I'd had for 30 years. I saved. I made a business plan and when I had to decide whether to have a website or go with e-Bay, my professional instincts told me that e-Bay was a better bet because internet marketing, web design, web administration and all the other things that go into building an internet business were not my area of expertise and it seemed as though they were e-Bay's. I know I am not alone in that thinking.

What I hadn't counted on was all the games that e-Bay plays with people's businesses - hiding listings, limiting visibility and on an on. Most other people haven't counted on it either, which is why you have so many people commenting on these forums. If it were all just fun for everyone no one would complain, don't you think?

If you go back to your original post and my response, I was responding because you were expressing frustration that people weren't reacting to your advice the way you think they should. I offered you one possible explanation for why that might be and then went on to explain my analysis of why I think E-bay is a bad bet for people trying to build salable businesses. If that does not describe you and you are just doing this for fun, then that part of my comments clearly are not directed at you, but rather the other users.

I wish you all be the best of luck setting up on Shopify, but be prepared for a rude shock: I had over 1,300 customers on E-bay, many of whom were repeats and I thought they would follow me to my website too. Only a few did. Even clients that I spoke to regularly over E-bay's messaging system either did not respond to my e-mails at all, or they told me to get lost. That is when I realize something very crucial:

To your customers you are like the waiter at your favourite restaurant where you are a regular.

Let that sink in for a minute and imagine. You go to this joint for dinner every week, and you have been going for 20 years. You know the head waiter by name. Suppose one day the head waiter quits and says he is opening his own restaurant. Do you go? Maybe. But chances are you just wish him well and keep going to the same place. Why? Because to you, the value is in the quality of the food and the ambience - both things that you don't attribute to him, even though his manner has a lot to do with it. And that's even if you get to talk to him about it before he goes. What is a much more likely scenario is you go one week and he's gone and you say to the next waiter "where's Roy?". And he says "he quit". That's it.

So, this is what happens with e-Bay. It's artificial loyalty. The loyalty of 90% of your customers is to the platform. Not, and I repeat not to you, in exactly the same way as what I just explained. They come for the deals and they come for the absolute no-risk, no responsibility guarantee that e-Bay gives any Tom, Dick and Harry that buys from there. They give them the shirt off your back and most are only too happy to take it. Of course they may buy from you out of habit, and they may appreciate what you are doing. But most will not assume that you can offer them the same value on your own. It's not even that they don't believe in you, rather they don't think about you when they aren't shopping on e-Bay.

I hope I'm wrong in your case, I really do, because I follow this blog every single night, even though I hardly ever post. I've read most of your posts over the years and you sound like a very sincere and hard working seller, despite doing it for fun. I can only tell you what my experience was when I left as a top-rated 4.9 and 5 star seller. Hardly anyone came with me. I had to contract work to survive while I built the shopify site.

Shopify is fantastic, but it can take up to a year of iterations to come up with a website that will rank well in Google and will retain traffic. Shopify really stays completely out of your business. I never hear from them, except when my bill is paid every month and when I call them. I can call at 5 in the morning and I'll get an English speaker in either Ireland or New Zealand and they always know what they are talking about. So, it will be an adjustment - a welcome relief.

But I think you will find that your e-Bay business is only worth what you can sell your inventory for in bulk. There is no goodwill value - because E-bay can take your account away from you anytime and I doubt user accounts are transferrable, in which case you can't even sell your feeback score. Nobody's going to pay for something that can be taken away at any time, for any reason and with zero accountability or transparency.

by: CanBrit

@AngrySeller

You've made some excellent points. I am a bit ashamed that I took the stance I did. I just want to help those who are struggling. When I was allowed on the boards that's what I did.

While I say it's for fun, I suppose what I mean is that I don't need the money. I am very very lucky in that way. But I am not immune to the shabbiness in which eBay treats it's sellers, It's very own livelihood. It's been years in the making and maybe in the past few, it's all about unloading it. I do think in the next year eBay as we know it will cease to exist. I get furious at many things they've done, not just to me but almost every seller. No one gets untouched in some way.

Such pure ignorance is astounding. But it's their shop and they can do as they see fit. In reality, if I could ignore their business (or lack of) methods, I'd just keep doing what I'm doing. I am disabled and I am not one who can sit still. If I am limited physically then I have to do something that keeps me stimulated. Family have always said this is what I was meant to do, but my IT career was pure love.

My husband was recently put on disability, which is going to change both of our plans. When he retired we were always going to buy our dream trailer and take slow extended vacations with our brood of cats. We may be doing that sooner than we think then. Shopify may not be necessary. At sometime I do want to do something different.

eBay could very well turn around tomorrow and put a stop to my hi-jinx. I  know that. You cannot count on anything with them except its going to go wrong most of the time. My nest egg is my inventory. Its too big. I only have about  10% listed because that's about how much I can handle. Eventually it will become one big auction.

by: AngrySeller

Canbrit,

Wow. I had no idea. I'm sorry if I came off a little too strong. It sounds like we both want the same thing - to help others avoid the same problems. You're trying to help people who are determined to stay, and I'm trying to help people leave.

Part of the reason though that this type of company exists is because of that philosophy that people have of "It's their business they can do what they want". See, that's not the society I grew up in in the 1970's and 1980's. We used to have rules. We used to understand that having a company and using the legal and court systems was a priviledge and not a right. I don't believe that e-Bay has ANY right to do what it does. I don't care how many lawyers they have on staff or what garbage is in their TOS. Until we wrestle control of society back from the plutocrats we're doomed to have to accept this.

It's not right to offer to list someone's items and to encourage them to open a store and then hide 90% of their stuff, and THEN blame them for it when they complain that they can't pay their bills because their sales drop by 80% from what they historically were over a 5 or 10 year period. That is just wrong. It doesn't matter how you word it. Even when you read the TOS it doesn't sound like what it actually is. You have to be a lawyer yourself and have that kind of mind to interpret it properly.

Good luck with everything, and enjoy your cats. They do bring us joy at even the most trying of times. I have two little guys here and would get more if I could.

by: CanBrit

@AngrySeller

We have five feral's that we rescued off our property. We had 7 at one time. We have a very large property, off the grid, for health reasons. This environment helps me to live.

I too remember the 70's very clearly. A very different time. Some good, some not so good, but one thing is sure, eBay would not get away with the things they do now back then. The sit on their laurels thinking they are untouchable. I do hope someday, they are taught otherwise.

by: Robrolo

@CanBrit
@AngrySeller

Hear, Hear.