Ina Steiner EcommerceBytes Blog
News and insight focusing on ecommerce.
by Ina Steiner, Editor of EcommerceBytes.com
Sun Aug 12 2018 21:23:19

Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

By: Ina Steiner

Sponsored Link

eBay continues to raise the bar for sellers as it tries to keep buyers happy, and the Fall Seller Update offers further evidence that eBay finds it a lot easier to just side with buyers when disputes arise.

To wit, a new requirement around tracking that takes effect on September 10. The crux of the issue: eBay won't protect sellers from claims of non-receipt unless they've uploaded tracking prior to the estimated delivery date.

What's changed is the timing and method of providing tracking information: even if sellers can prove their packages have been delivered to buyers by providing shipping carriers' tracking numbers, they're out of luck unless they've uploaded tracking by a certain date. Note that sending the tracking number to buyers via member-to-member messaging does not meet the protection requirements at all.

The text of the new policy follows:

Upload tracking to prevent "item not received" claims
Starting September 10, 2018, you will be required to upload tracking in the structured data field before the estimated delivery date has passed in order to appeal an "item not received" claim. eBay will not protect you from a claim if you send the tracking number to the buyer via email.

Without tracking information, eBay can't protect you because we won't be able to confirm your item was delivered. Tracking also benefits buyers by enabling them to track the status of their deliveries. We will also update the eBay Money Back Guarantee policy with the new guidelines.

There was much discussion about this on the eBay boards (though many sellers may have missed it in the onslaught of news in the fall update).

Did eBay really mean it would side with buyers if the seller provides tracking after an "Item Not Received" claim (INR) is filed?

An eBay moderator made clear the answer:

"Yes, if a seller doesn't upload the tracking by the estimated delivery date we cannot guarantee they will be protected. The seller will still have the opportunity to provide the tracking through the case but if the buyer still insists that they didn't get the item the case will be closed against the seller."

A reader wrote to us about the change and pointed out a related mandate: "eBay is now going to require that the proof of Delivery show the address it was delivered to. USPS only shows the zip code and that has always been adequate, but now they are saying that is not. Wow what a massive change that they just buried in with all the other minutiae."

The problem: no carrier provides buyer addresses in their tracking reports, which are visible to third parties, for obvious reasons related to privacy. Nevertheless, eBay spells out in several places, including its help pages, the need for buyer addresses in tracking:

"To be protected, the tracking information will need to show proof of delivery from a shipping company that clearly displays the delivery status of the item as "delivered," the date of delivery (which reflects that you shipped within your stated handling time), and the recipient's address."

Sellers asked over and over for clarification - would eBay side with the buyer if the tracking information did not include the full buyer address? 

But the moderator jech77 continued to obfuscate.

In responding to eBay seller bubbleman2010 who wrote, "Does tracking when the new features roll out have to display the buyers address if a INR dispute is open in order to be found in the sellers favor? YES or NO," the eBay moderator responded, "I want to reiterate, the only thing that has changed is the requirement to upload tracking before the estimated delivery date. The information that we look at to validate the tracking will continue to be the same. We have not made any other changes," leaving sellers to worry there was a reason eBay left itself lots of wiggle room. Is it possible jech77 isn't sure him or herself?

Update 8/13/18: A different eBay moderator also weighed in on the issue in this thread -excerpt follows:

"USPS does not disclose a full delivery address publicly and for good reasons. We also don't validate to the exact street address for the same reason - sorry, I wasn't clear about that. We do look for a matching zip code.

"International shipments can be a bit more challenging as standards of data quality differ across countries and shipping carriers delivering to those countries. We do our best to manage policies according to what the standards are in those countries, but for US shipments, the main thing is making sure that the item was delivered within the same zip code as the buyer indicated in Checkout."

Comments (66) | Leave Comment | Permalink
Readers Comments

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

This user has validated their user name. by: Marie

Mon Aug 13 16:22:11 2018

@will

Buyer's can't file an INR at 45 days in Ebay.  But they sure could in PP.

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

This user has validated their user name. by: bitbybit

Mon Aug 13 16:33:36 2018

Typically when Ebay pulls their retroactive steal, I mean stunt, it goes back 3 months with higher volume sellers and 12 months for smaller sellers.

"Ebay thought it wasn't fair to sellers?" Now that's a hoot. When have they ever listened to sellers?

Everything eBay implements causes sellers pain. If not now, then down the road. If it didn't take or stick, then add on more tricky carrots and finish off with a taste of aged retro. Bon appetit

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

This user has validated their user name. by: Marie

Mon Aug 13 16:37:13 2018

@bitbybit

It is rare, but they have.  You are correct, Ebay for sellers with 400+ transactions in the previous 90 days will eval on that period and for those with less transactions, it goes back 12 months.

They have now said that for those they look back for 12 months, it will NOT do it for the SNAD update come Sept.  They will be only going back to June.

Heck it beats me if they will really do this.  It is just what they said.  I've seen no formal announcement of it, so who knows.

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

by: angryllama This user has validated their user name.

Mon Aug 13 16:58:31 2018

Blinding Revelation on the Road.   I was struck by the way the POINT of eBay changing to WANTING all tracking uploaded promptly and BEFORE the anticipated delivery date.    Anybody else want to take an educated guess?

My blinding revelation is that eBay wants the TRACKING numbers by an early date is so that eBay COMPUTERS could just RULE AGAINST the SELLER INSTANTLY if / when the tracking number had not been uploaded "in time".

ZOWIE !   If true then just another sign that the END IS NIGH for eBay.

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Mon Aug 13 19:52:14 2018

If eBay pulls this stunt (denying sellers rights due to "fake late" tracking) then:

1) eBay pulls more sellers into the %40 due to poor behavior
2) eBay can dump more CS employees since they dont need to investigate or figure anything out since the seller is automatically in the wrong
3) it can give buyers free goods on sellers dime - nothing to refund "if you didnt send it out and even if you did WE SAY you didnt - since you didnt upload it in the MAGIC time frame  (ALL data MUST be uploaded according to WENIG PLANE TIME!)
4) using Adyen it can take funds for this "seller error" without having to bow to Paypal

and much much more.

A lie is a lie is a lie - unless its eBay - then a lie becomes the truth "according to Wenig"

The San Jose Mafia strikes again !!!!!!!!!!!   (and eBay toadies, lackies, employees etc) COME SUE ME FOR SLANDER IF YOU HAVE THE CAJONES!

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

This user has validated their user name. by: Marie

Mon Aug 13 22:35:30 2018

Yes, it couldn't be because the buyers might like to track their packages.

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Mon Aug 13 22:43:32 2018

Marie - that’s what contact seller is for.

Please don’t tell me that in 2018 buyers are getting tracking.

At this rate, short of giving buyers the key to the front door of a sellers house - what do they need?

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Mon Aug 13 23:55:23 2018

arent getting tracking

correction*

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

This user has validated their user name. by: Marie

Tue Aug 14 02:10:00 2018

If the seller isn't uploading it for whatever reason the seller may have, then no the buyer is most likely not getting the tracking number.  That was my only point.  And yes it happens.  I had a seller do that to me a couple weeks back.  It wasn't until after I asked about the tracking that I was able to get tracking.  

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Tue Aug 14 08:59:32 2018

Marie - so if the seller doesnt do it in the time period eBay demands - eBay therefore has the right to deny the FACT that the tracking exists? Somehow they NOW have a right to defraud the seller - by pretending it never happened - and letting the buyer LIE about it?

MOST of the time its the buyers lieing - to try and get a free item. They see that the seller didnt upload a tracking number and try (hope) they can get it for free. They get mighty disapointed when the item comes in the mail and theres tracking.

Lets say you NEVER upload tracking - ever - you are a lazy shmoe ... so what?

As long as there are no complaints - why is it eBays business AT ALL?

IF theres a problem, then eBay could ask the seller to show the needed proof.

True its the right thing to do - add tracking as soon as the item ships. But if you read eBays own words - they dont care about anything but tripping up the seller - they want to see when the label was made and when the post office accepted it.

Is that all eBay has do to these days?  Is the vendetta against sellers so important? Did they finish fixing all the bugs and all the other issues - that they need to find some new metric to trip up sellers?

I call BS.

I ship via eBay shipping - so I have no dog in this fight - my issue - is the same ass always - eBays overreaching and creating reasons to steal money from sellers and mix in to a sellers business for NO reason.

eBay - the San Jose Mafia

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

This user has validated their user name. by: Marie

Tue Aug 14 12:27:53 2018

@pace

We just view things a bit differently. I see uploading tracking as just part of my job.  It is part of my customer service.  So to me the change regarding the uploading of tracking is no big deal.  I won't be affected by this portion of the update.

I get it that you see it differently and that your business may be affected by this change, so you see it as an issue.  I am not trying to argue your right to do or not to do as the rule will be requiring.

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Tue Aug 14 13:57:35 2018

... its not about "point of view" and it isnt an argument - especially since it doesnt really effect me.

The POINT was "was this trip really necessary?"  Why is this metric even needed? Why find another way to harass sellers?

Moreover - why does "the data change" depending when its uploaded to eBay?

Let me throw another scenario at you (since you disregarded my first).

Lets say you use UPS to ship and you export all your shipping to them. You ship it all out but neglect to upload it or it doesnt work but you upload it NEXT day or 2 days later.... OR (shudder) you use Amazon (who doesnt always post tracking "on time" when they use their shipping) ..... does that mean you should be punished because eBay says it must be with in 24 hrs "or else"?

I know alot of people who use UPS, FED EX etc ... why make their lives more complicated "just because you can"?

I have yet to hear ONE person explain why punishing sellers for no good reason is a good thing.

This is ecommerce - not the army .

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

This user has validated their user name. by: Marie

Tue Aug 14 14:21:52 2018

Maybe Ebay got too many complaints from buyers that couldn't see the tracking on their purchases?  I don't know.  I just know as a buyer I get annoyed when I can't view the tracking on something I would expect to be able to do so.  I just don't see this a big deal for most sellers in regards to the uploading of tracking.

The other questions that remain are very important to me as I'm still unsure of where Ebay stands on the address being on the tracking.  While the thread Ina quoted in the article says Ebay does not expect this, there have been other blues that have posted they did expect this.  Then when more clarification was asked for, not a single blue has address the question on any of the threads I read.

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Tue Aug 14 15:34:11 2018

Marie - I certainly can agree that its important to provide buyers with tracking - I dont think theres anyone who would argue it - and ... the sooner its provided - the better (for all concerned).

My issue was the creation of an issue that didnt need to exist - some kind of PUNISHMENT for sellers yet again.

You could tell me - and maybe Im right and maybe Im wrong (so to speak) that buyers in todays world are SO lazy that they cant communicate with their seller - I dont know. I do know - that they dont read descriptions - so maybe eBay is for the internets lowest form of buyer - the worst society has .... who knows.

Its just that a punishment for not doing it - saying that it you have it but you didnt upload it - invalidates its existence is just plain wrong (not to mention possibly criminal)(fraud).

As for your other question - I agree - its something that eBay is probably "floating a trial balloon for" ...... and I bet you all the money that Bobby Cupcake has stolen from sellers - that it will go into force when Adyen comes online.

Theres NO "friggin" way on this planet that Adyen is going to do any customer service. THAT leaves eBay - and the crimes of the century that they do each day.

As to not anger Adyen who will have to deal with the chargebacks and the complaints (and dont forget, they have conditioned people to call Paypal when theres an issue), eBay will do ALL the CS and tighten the restrictions that sellers have to do "to get paid".

You dont "really" think its "all" about the float do you ?

Just like you dont "see" that its unreasonable to create a penalty for late tracking uploading - im not sure you will "see" one when eBay makes it SC instead of DC.

After all - AMAZON does it - so why not eBay.

You will probably tell me "Maybe Ebay got too many complaints from buyers that say they never got their purchases? NO?

ANY change that eBay makes - has to be viewed with a suspicious eye.

NONE of these things are for a sellers benefit, they may make things "easier", but eBays war on sellers (#ebaysellerlivesmatter) says the opposite.

I dont put it past eBay to force SC (to avoid them having to deal with chargebacks and INRs where "technically" the seller is in the right - but the buyer then threatens to go to their cc company.

Who really knows with eBay? Theres a new crime each and every day on eBay.

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

This user has validated their user name. by: Marie

Tue Aug 14 16:22:57 2018

@pace

I don't care about the punishment either as it means nothing to me.  It may be that Ebay got too many complaints from buyers and other efforts to get seller that are ignoring loading tracking timely just haven't worked.  I don't know.  But either way, if the seller has a tracking number it should be loaded timely and for those that haven't been doing that, this may just be the incentive they need.

Ebay's online payment policy is a completely different subject from what is being discussed here.  I have concerns about it too.  Some are the same as you describe, some are not.

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

by: pace306 This user has validated their user name.

Tue Aug 14 20:13:48 2018

I don't care about the punishment either as it means nothing to me.

First they came for the sellers who didnt do 30 day free returns. But I do 30 day returns and it didnt matter to me - so I dont care

Next they came for the people who didnt want to use Adyen, or wouldnt commit to a store, or didnt put in UPC codes, or who needed more then 1 day for handling - but since none of those applied to me, they all meant nothing to me.

Now they are here because they want SC instead of DC, but theres no one here to help me. THOSE people were all taken down by the San Jose mafia - but I didnt care about them as they meant nothing to me.

As for the payments issue - your refusal to see linkage and causation is odd - but as nothing means anything to you - Im starting to understand.

You are %100 free to believe that the switch from Paypal to Adyen is about Applepay, the extra %1 float - or maybe that Santa uses Adyen - theres a sucker born every minute.

Smart people look at somethings past record and base FUTURE decisions on that past track record. A blind monkey can look at eBays PAST behaviors (its a defect, no its not a defect etc) (amongst the 10000000's of other nasty rotten eBay tricks/lies) and say "hey - something isnt quite Kosher here" and know - theres trouble around the corner.

If you think its altruistic, if you think its just about business as usual - thats fine - SOMEONE has to see the emperors new clothes.

The rest of society have seen eBays past behaviors and learned that when they do something - its ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS bad for the seller. Its been that way so far - since 2007 - I defy you to prove me wrong.

Adyen ISNT doing eBays CS (like Paypal does). That leaves eBay to do it and eBay is %99.99999999999999999999999999999999999 against the seller.

If the "you have valid tracking but didnt input it "in time" so therefore we will ignore it and hurt you" DOESNT prove eBays bad intentions - what will?

Im not looking for "converts" ie good eBay vs bad eBay. eBay is a tool (not the Tool here) - something to make money on. They arent your partner, your friend - they are the local mafia that you NEED to use - and you hope the VIG they charge you wont KILL YOU.

Funny how their past statements seem to have no effect on you - did they or did they NOT lie under oath in France? Are they or are they NOT "just a venue"?

IE somethings are black n white - they can be ignored - at your own peril.

eBays keeping the float is the SMALLEST issue sellers will face. eBay and their 2 cent CS agents (1/2 of which barely speak english) will continue to steal, rob and rape sellers AS MUCH AS THEY CAN, period. They do it NOW, they will continue - and with Paypal effectively GONE ... lord help ANY seller - wince eBay HATES small sellers,

Theres NOTHING stopping them from doing SC - nothinm zero, nada - and if it cuts back on their CS time, or buyers playing the "it was never delivered/it was stolen/INR game" hen they will do so - THEN where will you be ?

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

by: Snapped This user has validated their user name.

Tue Aug 14 21:11:18 2018

There's really two seperate albeit related issues here.

The first is eBay's NOYB 'rule' for timely data input.  Ok, that's certainly discussable pertaning to it's merit; though It doesn't seem there's argument against the need for the data itself.  Just the compulsion for arbitrary and needless 'deadline'.  Host Hypocrisy aside, CS is as CS does.

However....

When that same self-serving host then uses a lack of a totally arbitrary 'adequate timliness' to deny a provable FACT of existence of the data itself, that's unarguably wrong.  

Just wrong.  Period.

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

by: Shackles4Devin This user has validated their user name.

Tue Aug 14 21:15:51 2018

From what I understand Adyen is not happening.  Was told that a contract has been signed between eBay and PayPal until 2029. Called Adyen and the guy I spoke to put me on hold twice. Just asked if they were still contracted with eBay and he could not answer the question. He was in San Francisco. Told me to email them. What?? Go back and look at eBay's timeline. The article is dated 1/31/18. There is a disclaimer at the bottom. And, no new information since. Was told Adyen is not happening because eBay had an issue. Has anyone heard otherwise?  

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

This user has validated their user name. by: Ina

Tue Aug 14 22:00:41 2018

@Shackles4Devin you didn't say who told you about an eBay / Adyen / PayPal rumor, but it doesn't seem to be supported.

As recently as July 18, 2018, a Wall Street analyst asked eBay if its integration and testing with Adyen was on track, and eBay Chief Financial Officer Scott Schenkel answered in part:

"the team has made great progress this quarter on executing the plans. And in fact, next week we expect to launch our employee beta. And then we will roll out from there and are working already with sellers who will be invited to the initial 5% phase with our new managed payments experience later this fall and we will actually be sharing some of those plans with our sellers at the eBay Open next week."

And during the eBay Open conference on July 24, eBay briefed sellers about the new managed payments beta.

Neither eBay nor PayPal appear to have filed any notices on the SEC website about any updates to their operating agreements.

Perminate Link for Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril   Ignore New eBay Tracking Requirements at Your Peril

by: Shackles4Devin This user has validated their user name.

Tue Aug 14 22:35:13 2018

@Ina  It was a PayPal employee who told me. I asked her several times and, she confirmed that Adyen was not going to be working with eBay. This is just was what told to me. I agree, the SEC is not aware. Maybe she misreported the information but, she sounded pretty informed. Do you know of that 5% is Ayden involved? Or is it Apple Pay? Thanks, Ina

Click to view more comments
1 2 3 4  [Next Page]


Login is required to post comments.
To sign in to leave a comment using your AB Verify User Name, fill in the form below. If you have not yet signed up for AB Verify, or if you'd like more information, go to the Registration Page
.

Login for AB Verify
Be sure and use your email address and password to log in.

 
Email:
Password:
 
 Forgot Your Password?
 Even though you are signed in with the AuctionBytes Blog, you will have to sign in to the EcommerceBytes blog. But you can sign in with your existing AB Verify info.