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Tue July 21 2009 15:44:14

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

By: Ina Steiner

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Deadbeats bidders and buyers are the bane of an eBay seller's existence. It can take 2 months to resolve a case and get credit for fees on transactions that have never been consummated. All the while, sellers' inventory is frozen until the claim is resolved. To add insult to injury, sellers complain that shoppers who fail to pay for an item can leave them negative feedback if they file a UPI claim against the shopper.

Now that eBay has moved to an electronics payments only system (it banned checks and money orders last fall), it has been looking at ways to speed up the UPI ("Unpaid Item") process - under certain conditions.

eBay is considering implementing an automatic UPI process for payments for fixed-price items for sellers who accept PayPal or ProPay and use its checkout system. The automatic UPI system would take days, rather than weeks. A manual process would apply to all formats and payment methods, and would have a timeframe of about 2 - 3 weeks. And ultimately, sellers' feedback would not be dinged by non-paying customers.

Additionally, eBay would block sellers from filing a UPI claim when the buyer has paid via PayPal or ProPay.

Note that eBay currently has an Immediate Payments option for sellers who wish to require buyers pay immediately, but the option only works with PayPal payments and does not allow the seller to offer combined shipping for buyers who purchase more than one item.




Comments (40) | Permalink

Readers Comments

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: Peter

Tue Jul 21 16:41:25 2009

Here's yet another area in which eBay is years behind the market -- and rather than just pull the trigger with a complete solution, they offer up half-assed measures to try and band-aid things, all while never really eliminating the problem.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: John

Tue Jul 21 16:43:40 2009

I don't believe this for one minute. IMHO this is just another way to get people to use paypal. Sure sign up for PP and we will make sure we handle your  dispute promptly and professionally. As anyone ever seen eBay handle anything promptly. Don't get fooled by this company.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: eBuyer Feedback

Tue Jul 21 16:49:40 2009

By making the process automated you are only telling the buyers it is their right to not pay.  No harm, no foul so it must be OK.

What eBay needs to do is prevent it from happening in the first place.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: Phil

Tue Jul 21 16:53:34 2009

If they had a universal registration process, this would eliminate the problem from the get go. One user id per person & that's it. If the user gets kicked off for playing games or not paying, they would not be able to re-register on ebay with a new id and start the game over again, like they are able to do now with no problem. You suck Ebay!

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: eBuyer Feedback

Tue Jul 21 17:00:54 2009

There are legitimate uses of multiple ids and in fact eBay requires developers do so.  What they need to do is have a common link (credit card, bank account, confirmed address, etc) between all of them collectively.  For instance 3 NPBs across all ids and then all ids are suspended.  The way it is now you just have to hope that eBay can detect them via similar registration data and IP addresses and hope one of those gets suspended.  That's not a reliable system and is easily circumvented.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: PleasePayNow

Tue Jul 21 18:04:20 2009

Last week I spoke to Ebay's customer service about this very problem. I have had three buyers use BIN and have yet to pay-one UPI has already been filed. I suggested that it should be automatic when a buyer uses BIN they should have to pay immediately without having to use the Require Immediate Payment feature. Ebay takes their fees right up front but sellers must wait. To add insult-the buyer can leave negative feedback??!!  That is just insane-sellers should be able to leave some type of feedback at least to show if the buyer paid or not. Ebay is just making it harder and harder on sellers and it's not right.  

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: Ginny

Tue Jul 21 18:18:48 2009

We accept payments through Propay. Currently we're running into the ''success'' of ebay's marketing strategy linking Paypal with ''safety''. Buyers are buying our items and then are alarmed by the fact that we do not take Paypal and we have to talk them into paying by explaining Propay. Sometimes they just don't trust us, regardless of our having been antiques dealers long before ebay's Pierre was ever born and despite our great feedback and DSRs which now appear to be irrelevant. Then we have to file a UPI and potentially get into an argument with a buyer who is paranoid about Propay since it is not Paypal. They even think that nothing except Paypal is allowed! Not realizing that if it wasn't allowed, it would not be linked on the invoice by eBay!

We are consigned by distrustful buyers to the vast unsafe pool of sellers that ebay's Paypal is allegedly there to protect buyers from. The image of the unsafety of ebay's sellers being something that ebay is exploiting to market Paypal. What kind of company trashes the businesses that they themselves do business with every day so that they can market another business that they own? Ebay is that kind of company!

They are being successful in this marketing approach as many have the perception that Paypal will protect them. The cost of that marketing approach is measured in the harm to the reputation of ebay as a place to buy plus the loss of sales due to those who will not buy through Paypal no matter what ebay does or says. There is a further unknown cost due to the trashing of all of the excellent business people on ebay and the implications that other payment methods are unsafe.

As long as ebay continues to market Paypal in this manner, how is any immediate payment required method going to succeed using Propay? How is any immediate payment method that does not use Paypal going to succeed?

The success of a marketing campaign based on negativity towards the very businesses that do business with ebay is having and will continue to have negative results on everyone's bottom line. All due to ebay's putting the promoting of Paypal up there as a number one priority.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: Ebay's Slow Death

Tue Jul 21 18:27:27 2009

@Ginny-

Great comment!

Ebay constantly shoots itself in the foot and Sellers in the foot.  And, we are all limping along pretty badly now.

Thanks Ebay for all your dumb policies!

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: fruity

Tue Jul 21 18:41:15 2009

That's ebay psychobabble. They're doing it for other reasons. Probably to justify why propays payment system has to "share" information with ebay and to keep other alternative payment systems like GOOGLE CHECKOUT there. Propay basically assumed the fetal position to get into ebay and then they jacked up the rates.

Ebays a bunch of psychopaths with MBAs. THey'll give you a crumb so they can split the community into groups. If you give them an inch they'll take a mile.

You're tossing out that just like how Bill Cobb tossed back that nickel when all heck broke loose and they had to create a new position and bring in John Donahoe. You think we dont know this is 2005 coming back.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: fruity

Tue Jul 21 18:43:00 2009

Hey ebay, how's this. You start being a venue, go get that reflective tape vest and put out some of those orange cones & drum up traffic. And MAYBE we don't start calling all the States Department of Taxation and Depart of Labor and tell them how you're not a venue, you're our boss and we want the states to fine and collect backwages and put it into the states coffers.. just for kicks

Your business is to keep the lights up,servers running and sweep the floors. I guess maybe you dont get that. Letting things go from bad to worse only lifting a finger when you can justify your dominance & fend off competition is so obvious even you recognize how you are now obsolete with technology.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: Lester

Tue Jul 21 18:43:17 2009

Now is also the time for them to do one other thing that has been asked for for years. When a UPI claim is successfully filed, eBay should put an ADMINISTRATIVE note in the buyers feedback indicating they didn't pay. This note should be in RED so it stands out. It is not a positive, neutral or negative, it is simply a FACT that the user was a DEADBEAT. This would also answers sellers cries that they can't leave feedback on non-payers. Let eBay do it. It makes sense.

That's why they will never do it.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: RJ

Tue Jul 21 19:33:47 2009

Back in May on the one year anniversary of no moe negs for buyers I checked my records. I had over $6000.00 in claims for NPBs that total was more than I'd had in the 1st 8 years of selling on ebay.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: EX EBAY SELLER & BUYER

Tue Jul 21 20:02:11 2009

What a joke.If they wanted to fix this problem believe me it could have been done years ago.Non paying bidders caused me alot of Money & Hassles over the years,WHY all of a sudden there interested in sellers problems.I smell money somewhere.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: seller

Tue Jul 21 20:33:47 2009

What about eBay's str? If you have items ending with what APPEARS to be a sale but are never paid for how is this counted? As a sale for eBay?

Could be an incentive for eBay NOT to respond to harshly against buyers, it makes eBay seem much more successful then they really are.

Check out this buyer
jennjenn5486 she has bid on 7 full pages of items without paying for any. What does eBay do? Nothing.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: unaware

Tue Jul 21 20:35:33 2009

Well all right then, this makes up for EVERY SINGLE STUPID THING you have done in the last two years eBay... THANKS! All is forgiven. Now I can sleep easy knowing eBay has my best interests at heart.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: Patricia

Tue Jul 21 20:38:03 2009

@Fruity - priceless, to the point and bears repeating:

"Your business is to keep the lights up, servers running and sweep the floors. I guess maybe you don't get that. Letting things go from bad to worse only lifting a finger when you can justify your dominance & fend off competition is so obvious even you recognize how you are now obsolete with technology. "

NPB's should have been automatic years ago!  They don't pay, you get your fee refunded and both parties part company.  Buyers with enough NPB's get ousted just like years ago when a -4 in feedback would oust them.  What's the big deal?  Why all the hocus-pocus?  Ebay needs to play fair and stop making mad passionate love to buyers.  Bad buyers are bad buyers!  Deal with it!

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: deadbeat policy

Tue Jul 21 20:46:22 2009

It is interesting that the only plans are to speed up the claims process, but nothing that actually addresses the problem.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: RicRoe

Tue Jul 21 21:53:56 2009

This expedited process still does not have the teeth to eliminate the problem.  

As usual, Donahoe's eBay continues to dance around the issue instead of taking direct action to address the issue and eliminate future occurrences.

The current system supposedly places a strike against the buyer, but since that strike is invisible, there is nothing in the placement of a strike that deters bidders from the practice.

There is nothing in the new system that allows for bidders being unidentified as an NPB, so the practice will continue to tie up sellers, only for less time.

eBay could virtually eliminate NPB if they choose to by simply placing a system issued strike against the bidder on their public feedback record. Move the strike from the shadows and put it out front. Automatically remove a NPB from the eBay bucks program for a first offense... In other words, put some more serious penalties in place.

There is no need for any statement from the seller or even seller involvement. eBay should simply grab the bull by the horns and be proactive in the form of having the system place a visible notation on the sellers feedback profile. Nothing personal, just business.

Since eBay believes that suspensions are so effective, what's wrong with a suspension after a second strike in a 3 month period, and permanent suspension for a third strike after reinstatement.

Donahoe & Co labor under the belief that if every buyer is guaranteed a 100% feedback rating, there will be an increase in buyers.

Once again Donahoe & CO have displayed how little they understand the marketplace they call the shots for.

The reality is that there has been zero increase in buyers or buying activity since eBay eliminated negative feedback. ( or since they implemented ANY changes for that matter)

While it is not likely that eBay will reverse their no negative feedback policy for buyers, there should be no need to remind anyone that a bidder is not a buyer until they pay.

As such, a visible strike would be the best disincentive to eliminate non paying bidders.

At the rate Best Match has alienated legitimate buyers, eBay should not be handling Non Paying Bidders as if they were some valued commodity by tolerating the NPB activity on any level.

Donahoe & Co need to speed the process, identify the offenders, improve a sellers ability to block NPB's, clean up some of the mess and move on.

Of course giving sellers what they want, and buyers what they deserve is apparently not in the Donahoe playbook.





eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

This user has validated their user name. by: Mercy the Mingless

Tue Jul 21 22:01:29 2009

The explosion of deadbeat bidders are definitely one of the many evil aspects of Donahoe's ebay.  However, I would disagree that they are the worst.  After all, former CEO and delusional gubernatorial candidate Meg Whitman along with ebay's current president Lorrie Norrington both received negative feedback after not paying for auctions won.  It can't be that bad.  Can it?

The real bane (Bain?) of the ebay seller that is growing exponentially daily is the thief buyer who files a false Significantly Not As Described SNAD claim after making an ebay purchase.

Paypal does NOT investigate these claims and paypal does NOT look at so called ''evidence'' provided by the seller.

The thief buyer's SNAD claim is auto-approved by paypal on the condition the thief buyer return the seller's item with Delivery Confirmation.  Unfortunately, more and more sellers are receiving empty boxes or empty envelopes with Delivery Confirmation from thief buyers.  

Return of the seller's item is not important to paypal.  They refund the thief buyer's money based solely on a Delivery Confirmation number from the thief buyer showing he/she mailed... something.  

The thief buyer gets the money from paypal and keeps the seller's item.

Paypal listens to sellers' empty box complaints.  They tell the seller that they ''understand their frustration'' then instruct them to get a police report.  Paypal doesn't tell sellers that police departments are refusing to take reports for online theft.

It is a perfect crime ONLY made possible by the inept management, policies and dishonesty of ebay and paypal.

Yes.  Absolutely.  By all means.  Let's have another ebay/paypal spawned safety trust verification thingy to ''protect'' sellers.

Hey!  It's almost back to school time!  Sellers, get those notebook computers ready.  Should be a rockin' selling season.  I'm sure ebay and paypal will have that thief buyer false SNAD empty box return problem fixed by then.

eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process   eBay Looks to Speed up Deadbeat-Bidder Claims Process

by: confused

Tue Jul 21 22:24:07 2009

I am a little confused when you say the Unpaid item process can take months.
You can open a case on the 8th day after ''buyer'' wins item and close it after 7 days of non contact or even immediately after ''buyer'' contacts.
So, thats a total of 15-16 days. Not 2 months.
If a buyer files an chargeback then the process could take months to resolve but that is different than the UPI process.

Though, I agree that the current NPB time is way to long considering that all payments must be electronic. There's no reason to have to wait 7 days to file and another 7 to close.
It should be cut down to 5 to open and 3 days after that if the ''buyer'' doesnt respond to close.

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