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Sat Dec 1 2007 12:48:38

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

By: Ina Steiner

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Another high-volume seller has left the eBay marketplace. This time, it's liquidator Bargainland. AuctionBytes sat down with Paul St. James to find out why he decided to stop selling on eBay and what Bargainland is up to now. The article will appear in the December 2, 2007 issue of AuctionBytes-Update. (We'll provide a direct link to the story here on Sunday.)

Here's the link to the article (12/3/07).

What do you think this means for eBay? Is it a positive sign that eBay is cleaning up the site and getting rid of low-feedback sellers? Or is it a sign that high-volume sellers can't succeed on eBay? Share your thoughts here.




Comments (53) | Permalink

Readers Comments

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: Joe Doe

Sat Dec 1 14:35:45 2007

This is a sign that eBay is taking a stand against large voume sellers who choose to sell crap and not provide adequate customer service.  Large sellers can succeed on eBay with is evident by the thousands of top sellers on the site.

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: Joan Doe

Sat Dec 1 15:35:32 2007

I think it is a sign that high and low sellers can not succeed on Ebay...High Listing Fees + Low Sales Volume = Ebay Recession...

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: Henry

Sat Dec 1 17:04:19 2007

What was Bargainland's feedback score like?

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: Henry

Sat Dec 1 17:08:22 2007

Wow, I just checked it and they are at 90.5%.  That is truly pathetic.  1 out of every 10 customers is not pleased with the transaction.  I'm surprised they lasted this long.  If eBay want to improve the buyer experience, they need to actively kick these people off rather than wait until they go out of business.  

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: getreal

Sat Dec 1 19:21:16 2007

I love reading posts like Henry's here, who has neither a clue what he is talking about or any idea whatsoever what it actually takes to sell over 1 million products in that category. Not to mention have the ability to comprehend the idea that eBay itself is the problem.  For starters, eBay's feedback system is a joke. It was designed by a guy who himself had no experience selling products for a living. Any moron can leave a negative feedback for whatever reason he or she wants, including whether or not it is raining outside. Anyone who actually takes the time to anylize Bargainland's feedback will notice that an overwhelming majority of negative feedback were left either by new buyers who have either single or low double-digit feedback themselves, or buyers with no common sense.  Anyone with 1/2 a brain should be able to understand the concept that sellers who sell "AS IS" products that are advertised as "May or may not function", and starts their minimum bid at .99 cents, is going to attract the dumbest idiots in the world. "As is" sellers attract the worst kind of bottom feeders there are, so why is it a surprise that they don't have stellar feedback? What is amazing is that eBay actually lets these idiots leave feedback in the first place.

Another thing that most people fail to notice is that the very idiots who leave negative feedback for stupid reasons, go on to purchase more items from the same seller.  The problem is the feedback system itself, duh! 90% feedback for an "as is" seller is like anyone else having 97%, it's not bad at all.  90% of the buyers who leave negative fb are the ones who need to be removed.

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: Carl

Sat Dec 1 20:17:18 2007

Negative feedback system is just a joke.

You can't tell much by it.

Scenario...newer seller, low item volume.  Gets hit with the growing ebay scam...GETTING something for NUTHING.

Scammer buyer looks for newer seller, low feedback count, orders item then complains...either not as described..or better yet, never received, demands full refund.

Newer sellers who sent the item and have USPS confirmation think they're covered, but WRONG....can still get fraudulent feedback and have NO recourse against the buyer unless it fits within the narrow ebay confines for feeback withdrawl.  So the seller either loses $$ giving the buyer something for nothing OR they pay for it by getting a really LOW feedback percentage and then low to no future sales.

Basically all of this is another reason just to not look to ebay if one is a smaller sized seller and a newer one.  

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: jim

Sat Dec 1 21:02:05 2007

Move over ebay ,its a fact large volume sellers are leaving ebay in droves and starting there own sites .In Australia deals direct have left ebay and started out on there own and have really taken a slice out of ebay aust. i have been an ebay powerseller up until resent , they are without a doubt the most frustrating  ,difficult unhelpfull company out there .they will be decimated when a serious  ,cometitior has a go .
they are no wear in China , no wear in New Zealand , losing ground in Australia  the feedback system is a joke buyers who dont read sellers instructions regularly leave neg feedback and the seller wastes lots of time trying to resolve my message to meg...sell your stock ...or change your practice      

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: Cindy

Sun Dec 2 04:31:25 2007

I guess you will all say I drink the eBay koolaid. I am a powerseller with 100% feedback (14765 last I looked). I am happy with it but I work for it. I consider my customer service excellent.

I was a victim of Barginland and never left a negative. I just didn't leave any form of feedback because I was worried about retaliation. I know what I bid on, I know it was 'As Is' and had no problem with it. I just want my item, never arrived, no emails. I would say horrible customer service. I am glad they are gone. It makes it hard for all of us to try to make up for the "bad" customer service sellers. I love eBay. It has allowed me to close a brick and mortar and to stay home.

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: tellyp

Sun Dec 2 04:36:06 2007

Getreal & Carl your so on the money ...ebays feedback system is really a joke & totally stupid as it can by manipulated by any true scammer...just buy 20 ebooks a day ....the stars are also a truly moronic idea.
eBay has lost the magic + a great deal of buyers & sellers as this season is showing

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

This user has validated their user name. by: Ming the Merciless

Sun Dec 2 05:22:08 2007

Once again what ebay is attempting to do is to transfer as much liability and as many business costs that will enhance THEIR bottom line onto sellers.

What ebay wants are sellers who drink the ebay Koolaid and buy into the language ebay uses to frame their policies. Ebay recently sent Powersellers a brochure that suggested every seller should offer free or deeply discounted shipping and include free gifts with every order.

Does ebay offer to help underwrite these buyer experience enhancing ideas? Of course not, silly! Ebay expects you the seller to further decrease your profitability by bearing these burdens so thaty ebay can increase their profitability.

When competitors engage in the kind of practices that St. James alleges, they are in violation of laws in many states that prohibit interfering with a business transaction. And ebay is a co conspirator by permitting it on their site because they have the capacity to find out the IP numbers of those who illegally SABOTAGING another seller. But what you can expect from a company who in practice approves of threats of physical violence because a seller won't give a discount and refuses to suspend the member making the threat even when done through ebay's own mailing system.

Moreover, ebay's proposed new feedback concept in which they're threatening to automatically leave positive feedback for buyers who pay immediately with PayPal is a blatant and egregious example of interfering with a business transaction. Ebay has no legal right to leave ANY kind of feedback on behalf of a seller. NONE. And if they think building such a policy in to the user agreement shields them, they are 100% wrong.

And so much for believing ANYTHING ebay says about any topic. This secret detailed seller feedback is another example (just like the hidden user ID bidding that goes on that increases sales prices and ebay's cut but is an open invitation to shill bidding) of ebay's ongoing campaign of lies and deceptions to sellers. So much for ebay ''transparency.'' So much for ebay being ''just a venue.'' So much ebay's annual lies about not making major platform changes in the third quarter.

What sellers have become -- one new policy at a time -- are unpaid ebay employees so be sure to call your local IRS office and complain. You can do so anonymously.

Ebay management has succeeded in this decade only because the economy, though much weaker than it once was in 1990s, has allowed them to regularly unveil unnecessary and unconscionably high fee hikes to increase the value of their stock which is an important component of Meg and Bill's compensation packages. They think only in terms of quarterly increments. They don't have nor have they ever had a VIABLE long term business strategy except to soak sellers for as much as they can get BY ANY MEANS NECESSARY (legal or otherwise) for as long as they can. Their idea of thinking something through is like the ''ideating'' commercial currently running on TV. They are institutionally incapable of seeing beyond their outstretched hands.

When their tenuous house of cards falls as seller as after says sayonara to the dead corporation walking, Meg, Bill, and their lame brain minions will be out of there so fast your head will spin.

Yes, people can and should leave ebay. But, in addition to making URS complaints which we all can do NOW anonymously, exiting sellers should file massive consumer/civil/criminal complaints with their state Attorney General and the California Attorney General as they leave. And if you have complaint(s) about PayPal, the above three plus the Nebraska Attorney General.

What we all have to understand that ebay has no core business ethics whatsoever, and the only ''community'' value they subscribe to is the value of taking more and more money from sellers without providing any seller experience enhancements and providing as little of their laughable customer service as they can possibly get by with.

Ebay is an unregulated monopoly that violates the Sherman Anti Trust Act in so ways they're too numerous to mention here. And nothing would make this seller happier than to see Meg, Bill, and the other varicious, overpaid, arrogant, and underexperienced yuppy dot commer members of their management team join Enron executives in federal prison for engaging in monopolistic, anti competitive schemes designed to ruin or shut out their competition, make ssellers unpaid employees, design search pages that take buyers away our listings, by having conveniently technical problems that increase the likelihood you won't your item which is exactly what ebay want$, their defective scheduling platform in my ebay double list single items and relist already sold items without a seller's knowledge, stripping one or more photos from listings -- the list is endless AND THEY GET AWAY WITH IT!

And if a seller complains too long and too loudly about getting the fee refunds they're entitled to when ebay screws up a listing or several hundred in my case, then your communications suddenly become ''unprofessional'' and you lose your dedicated powerseller phone and email support.

There is NOTHING ebay won't do to mess over sellers large or small. NOTHING.

Sellers can fight back by leaving AND sellers can fight back by documenting and filing complaints with their state's Attorney General's Office or getting an attorney to take a class action suit on contingency.

As the film character Howard Beale once said, ''I'm as mad as hell, and I'm not going to take it anymore!''

Quit being a seller wuss and GET MAD, sellers! Ebay is r*ping us.

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: jsicolts

Sun Dec 2 06:36:04 2007

BargainLand was no bargain. Shoddy merchanisde, very slow delivery time & extra high shipping and handling, BUT that should not be eBay's concern - they are simply a listing platform. We would like to sell more sellers leave eBay as well.

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: Peter Leeflang - CEO Leeflang Archive Corp

Sun Dec 2 07:27:11 2007

It is always sad to see another major seller go. I say this out of pure selfishness, since the major sellers attract the bulk of the traffic. The small sellers are just bottom feeders, following the big ones in their path to catch their crumbs.
That does not mean small sellers are bad. Once there are many of them in the path of the big ones, they complete the submarkets, the nichjes, thus creating even more traffic as buyers then come for a 'one stop shopping experience', where both broad and deep product choice availability keep them hooked.

Even Bargainland had its role in this. In a real Capitalist market there will always be buyers for sellers with mediocre service in exchange for bottom prices. Whatever Bargainland was offering in positive value was apparently sufficient to attract tons of buyers, despite their bad rap with some.

Getting rid of those type of sellers is not a good idea of Ebay. It will dry up the marketplace (without sellers there are no buyers) and it also takes away a competitor for other sellers so they are less under pressure to perform best (so expect less service, higher prices from them).

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: Terry

Sun Dec 2 07:33:07 2007

Bargainland did itself in, and especially not from any feedback system on ebay.

Remember when ebay sold items on the site, they didn't start any auctions at 99 cents, but they tell the sellers
that is what the buyers like to see, 99 cent opening bids, or better yet starting at $0.01.

Ebay, is the venue platform for selling, that its main function.  If you listen to ebay on how to sell, and what the
buyers like, you might become the next big Powerseller that is losing more than what you take in.

Go to his feedback page, and view the items that he sold for less than $20, and even if he made 1/2 off the S/H
costs, think again of what he paid for the item and what he sold it for.  Even go to his new website and check what
he sells for less than its true value, starting at 99 cents.

Sellers on ebay have forgotten the first concept of what ebay is all about. You have items in your closets,
garages, homes, etc. that you don't use and you want to sell them.  Or, You are a supplier of goods to other
retail outlets in your area, and you want to sell to the public nationwide or worldwide, ebays the solution.

But you wouldn't start a bid for 99 cents, for an item that you normally sell for, or that you know is worth $100.00.  
And take the chance that it sells for more than 99 cents.  Especially knowing upfront that 20% of any profits you
make are going to Advertising costs.  Or, at least 4 warehouses with all those employees and utilities that you have
to pay.

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: Jay

Sun Dec 2 08:41:01 2007

eBay is simply a venue for buyers & seller. The should let the buyers decide for themselves whom to do business with and whom to not. I applaud Bargainland and wish them much success. eBay needs to keep their nose out of everyones business and run an auction  house like real auctions are run.

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: Dan

Sun Dec 2 10:13:04 2007

eBay must remain a venue for buyers and sellers and lead by example and treat others the way they want to be treated.  Their new DSR process is flawed.  If eBay has changed its community values its time they update their values page http://pages.ebay.com/community/people/values.html

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: Casey

Sun Dec 2 11:03:13 2007

Much of Bargainlands negative feedback was due to non-delivery of products.  Had they actually delivered the items they promised to these buyers, their feedback would have been much higher.  

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: GlobalJ

Sun Dec 2 11:59:11 2007

Good Bye to Bargainland or better phrased HOWTOGETSCAMMEDONEBAYLAND;

I too was defrauded by them.Purchased 2 items,read the ''AS IS'' terms and even paid the highly inflated shipping because I had a use for the items.Never received in 2 weeks,never received in a month and never received at all,numerous emails and when some one did respond I was threatened by them that I was a scammer (100% positive feeback as a buyer in over 1,000 transactions),I was told they know where I live and I would be better not to mess with them.Course,I received the email after I left them negative feedback after 95 days and they wanted to know how I did that.Freakin idiots.

What did in Bargainland was one thing and one thing only,it's called the transaction is not done when they receive payment,it's called no customer service.Eventually this company will scam the wrong person and they'll be behind bars where they should be.That's what Ebay themselves should do is pursue legal action against scammers like bargainland.

It's better for all Ebay sellers and buyers when a company like Bargainland is gone.And to getreal up above.You sound very much like the email I did receive from them.Absolutely blame all their negatives on inexperienced buyers when it has to do with Bargainlands poor handling of followthru after a sale.

GOOD RIDDANCE TO BARGAINSCAM

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: Jewel

Sun Dec 2 12:49:56 2007

Hooray for Bargainland, now known as Bidtopia for leaving eBay. I'm sure their fees were astronomical. While they were on eBay I must've purchased 60 large furniture items, and I only had a problem with 4 of them and I received partial refunds for all of them. No problem. I think they've had a bad rap with customers who aren't being careful or reading what they are buying. Such as buying 1, 2 or 3 star items and expecting an excellent condition item. They have had problems, but they've been working to fix many of them and I think they've improved much. If I bid on an item and they can't find it, I'm refunded immediately. Out of the 50 items I've purchased off of Bargainland Premier (now Bidtopia) a few were damaged, perhaps in shipping, but I was refunded for them. Bargainland has improved and I give them thumbs up.

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: L

Sun Dec 2 12:53:51 2007

ebay keeps shooting itself in the foot, ''fixing'' things that aren't broken.  I closed my ebay store over a year ago when they started gouging a 10% selling commission.  My ebay store sold approx 250-300 items per month, but, when you resell competitive items that many others also sell, then 10% FVF is not worth it ... it dropped my profits to less than minimum wage.

The ''stars'' added to ebay's feedback
system sucks. (Note that I have over 5,000 positive feedbacks and a 100% positive rating, so this isn't a sour grapes opinion. The stars system is stupid, and creates more potential problems than it solves.

Having closed my store, my powerseller days on ebay are over and I only sell about 1 item per week there, via auction format.  If they implement the ''automatic positive feedback'' idea that is being considered just because buyer pays, I will most likely leave ebay altogether, just on principle.  Yet another dumb idea (automatic buyer feedback) by a company that just doesn't get it.

Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay   Bargainland Bids Adieu to eBay

by: jantie

Sun Dec 2 13:28:50 2007

the price of getting bigger than the auction house where you host your activities...

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