Do eBay and Amazon Ding Sellers for Buyers' Inattention?

by: GetAGrip

Hard to think that a seller with RED SWEATER in the description would ever get a buyer that asks what color is the sweater. That is your first clue that the buyer is ignorant and needs to be blocked. Some buyers are illerate, incompentent and should never be allowed to use a computer for anything. BUT in the end fleecebay allows these fools to exist and will allow them to ding the seller as they got a red sweater and thought they were buying blue one.

by: Snapped

There’s a documented … unfairness to venue application of ‘customer judgement’ metrics to be sure.  Especially when it comes to any examination of evidence prior.  And especially hypocritical when it comes to how they treat their own customers. It’s become a familiar tune.

But that’s not just sellers, it’s buyers too, and we are all buyers if we ‘use’ the venue.  That’s the root here.  

Consider how just a few threads over, a seller reports receiving cold calls from eBay urging them to consider lowering shipping costs by ‘passing along eBay’s discounts’ (and btw -;’free’ shipping means eBay inc. can boast it more and gain more volume discount), oh, and because buyers seem to be balking at them.  

Sure boss, how ‘bout right after you suck back that FVF tax - with auto-increase function - on shipments you have NO involvement in?  Who do you think pays for that every time your artificially enhanced inflation machine triggers so *I* and mine can keep eating?

That’s right, it’s either the buyer, or me, the other buyer.  The one’s you claim are yours either way, and in whose best interest you stake a high ground flag upon.

…Meanwhile, a few threads thataway, initial reports of eBay’s ‘duly considered’ item page re-design are not encouraging in the ‘making it clearer for the buyer’ department.  Not too surprising since we have it on sanctioned authority the ‘seller committee’ selected to ‘advise’ them were summarily dis-invited to the discussions less than halfway through.  That’s how much eBay values even their ‘chosen’ customers.

So what’s all that to do here?  Funny how things connect -

“ “ Buyer wants to return an item, ordered by mistake because they didn't read the description. I really don't blame them, eBay made it almost impossible to read the descriptions with their promos,..” “

Not to exclude or excuse the ‘careless’ buyer, it’s the venues themselves who employ ‘marketing research’ (now force fed to an immature AI architecture) pertaining to ‘typical’ visual attention span in their page design.  But they do not consider how managing it to feature the elements of the main attraction (your listing) in the same way, unobscured by ‘helpful suggestion’, actually better enhances their “buyer experience”.  And the ‘other’ buyer’s too.

Because that would cut into THEIR profits now focusing more on AD revenue than on anything to do with YOUR sales.  Or even more intangibly, the buyer’s experience.

Much cheaper to CLAIM concern for it, and coerce the seller (who is also the ‘buyer’ of their services) into a no questions asked kowtow, regardless of either carelessness, or considered confusion.  Under threat of sanction without due process no less.

And it will only end when there’s no one left to do it to.  ‘Sellers’, or buyers.

by: GetAGrip

@Snapped

You might be a seller and a buyer BUT I CERTAINLY WOULD NEVER BUY ANYTHING ON FLEECEBAY PERIOD. Your apoligizes accepted.

by: Snapped

If you sell there, you are buying their service.  In fact, you are buying the only thing they actually do sell, in whatever guise.

by: pace306

This is a silly discussion

eBay FORCES you to put size and color in “item details “ therefore it’s not the seller’s problem “anymore “

If it was like “days of old” where eBay kept its nose out of every one’s business then MAYBE.

But in today’s eBay where they have become your unasked for partner - you should be off the hook, period

If eBay hides it behind below on top on bottom- it’s not the seller’s problem. Sellers have NEGATIVE input on page design

“Go find some one else to blame 24/7 besides sellers”

by: comments

No surprisingly this is just a moony grab. The reasons for SNAD returns don't always mean what they mean. Most of my SNAD returns are not as pictured in the listing or description and the notes usually have some variation of "this dot was too small to see in the pics"

by: None Such

I don't accept returns, but if course that policy is meaningless on eBay where eBay forces me to accept returns, for whatever reason.  If a buyer can't read a description, too bad for them.  I once ordered an item too quickly and discovered when the item arrived that it was different from what I expected, but that I had not fully read the description. My bad.  It didn't occur to me to ask to return it.  

by: SGal

The not reading the description problem is rampant on Etsy as well.  Etsy more or less hides the description by only showing three short lines of it with the fourth line partially grayed out and then a ''learn more about this item'' link.  At least on eBay when a buyer does find the description it is all there.  Etsy also moves the description here, there and where is it?  One day it's on the right of the page, next day it's at the bottom moving it back and forth.  It's crazy!

by: regina

Add Etsy.  
THEY deliberately try to make it harder to find the description  link, or so it is often said / surmised in Etsy face book groups.
   Maybe Etsy don’t like much reading, thinking it slows down the process.  
  Although they put the reviews front and center.  So who knows.  
   Sad the descriptions aren’t highlighted more.  
   You can often tell a new shop, or an unprofessional one, as they don’t have an extra thing in their photos to provide at least one visual cue to scale.  Something as simple as pic with holding the object with a human hand.  Or with a coin or soooomething tangible in size, to help provide scale.  Otherwise enjoy more returns.  

by: I_Fix_Dolls

When size matters, I believe there is an item called a "Ruler" that can be included in the second picture of the item. On Aliexpress, (Why not go to the source of some sellers products?) they have things like carry-on bags with dimensions drawn on the photo. Another idea would be to put important details into a text photo so it is up there with the pictures.

by: pjgriff

I had a buyer than admitted he did not read the measurements and ebay made me refund his money.  This was 3 years ago or so when it was EASY to see the descriptions.   Now, the print is SO SMALL for the descriptions, half the time I cannot find it and when I do, it's 5 words long or says "see photos".  Nothing about condition, whether it works, measurements - some sellers are as bad as buyers.

by: Ophelia1

by: I_Fix_Dolls:

I always include a picture of the item with a ruler on all my listings, and it is still a problem. A lot of buyers just don't look or read but they are quick to blame the seller for their mistakes and they use the review system as a weapon against the seller.  

by: dmg61

Etsy is just as bad.  I have a customer returning a bead because it has a hole in it.  Think about it.

by: toyman

I have been on eBay for 25 years and there have always been people who can't seem to grasp the function of the Description. However, since eBay has become a nation of people shopping on their I-phones, the problem has grown exponentially. The type is too small, the Description Link is not prominent and WAY too many people just can't be bothered to read, just look at the pictures.

I can't tell you how many answers to Buyers Messages have begun with ''As we stated in our Description...'' Most INAD returns are really either Buyer's Remorse or Failure to Read Description returns, not that it matters, at all, to eBay.

To use a phrase I have heard, all too often, from eBay Help Desk : ''Just consider it part of the cost of doing business.''

by: Fruitylovesyou

I would just say this is for a broke busted up bag of chipped parts

by: mindelec

i just had a buyer leave me a this feedback....

"I'll give you a positive feedback but it should have been mentioned that the book had the cd missing, not much value without it. Sorry I made the deal."

right below that is the item title where NO CD-ROM was in capital letters, and then again twice more in the listing.  can't force people to see what they don't want to see.

by: lisapar

It doesn't matter what the Buyer's return reason is -- they have learned that lying about the return reason gets them a free shipping label.  But in addition, Amazon's ambiguous return reason "Item Defective or Doesn't Work" combines a confusing term "Doesn't Work".  Does the item not function (turn on)? or does the item not "work" for your purpose (color doesn't match the buyer's color scheme)?  These are two different meanings: if it doesn't work, then yes, it's defective.  If it doesn't match your color scheme, then the Buyer should pay for the return shipping.

I've said it all along -- there are groups on Facebook and YouTube that coach buyers on how to receive a FREE Return label.  Thus....the buyer makes up a lie "not as described" to get the free label, even if they don't necessarily believe it was NAD.

by: Disgruntled_Seller

Some don't read ...

Some can't find it due to the venue's inabilities to show it and/or all the crap on the page ...

Some read and don't understand, the understanding is on the part of the seller to correct if possible ...

Some would not see a bill board in front of their face if they were speeding along and it was centered in their lane ...

Some lie to get their item returned or refunded ...

by: shut1968

Yes, Amazon dings you for anything not returned as "no longer needed" or "changed mind" the bigger issue with Amazon is they have gone to great lengths to hide so much of the product page for mobile users to speed up how quick they can click on something and buy it that they have to dig on the mobile page in order to find most important information.. and their bots monitoring conversations are out of control and will flag an item when someone asks a simple question it picks up on as a product that violates something and then your flagged and having to send off invoices for just simply answering a question.. not a customer complaint just a simple question.

They also go to great lengths to hide the fact the customer is buying from a third party seller so that they think they are buying it from Amazon and the average person just figures they are ripping off a billion dollar company not any small business, Just yesterday I had to explain to someone we don't handle their payment information they needed to contact Amazon about any card issues and they insisted I was Amazon and got irate, in the end I had to say sir, you did not buy this FROM Amazon, you bought it ON Amazon from a vendor that fills orders when they are placed, kind of like going to going to a shopping mall and purchasing from a store inside, you didn't buy it from the mall, you bought it from the store that was selling it.. I guess finally he figured it out because he quit messaging after that.

Amazon allows returns for anything and very little recourse when you get ripped off, Walmart is 100% worse.. I have a person on there who once every couple weeks will order, 5, 10, 15, items of the same product and returns them about 10 days later as "stating they found a better price and Walmart takes them as a return for each individual item and then forces me to pay for shipping back that's 3 times more that it actually costs to ship it.. I've contacted their foreign customer support several times about it and they are useless.. You can't even block a buyer and I asked about cancelling the orders and they said I could but it would affect my cancellation metrics and each item cancelled is a hit to you metrics (5 items ordered, 5 items cancelled = 5 hits to your cancellation metrics)

My butt whole cringes every time I see an order for more than one or two show up because she will do it from different accounts or something as the address always changes but is always around the same delivery area.