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Wed Nov 26 2008 15:52:48

Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

By: Ina Steiner

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Shoplet.com listings disappeared from eBay this afternoon. When contacted, Shoplet CEO Tony Ellison said he could not comment on his eBay sales activities and would not answer any eBay-related questions. Ellison confirmed he was continuing to sell on Amazon.com and on Shoplet.com's own website.

A source had told AuctionBytes in the fall that eBay was working with ChannelAdvisor to bring Shoplet.com onto the site under the Operation Catalog program for Diamond PowerSellers, and over 2,000 listings were loaded onto eBay in October. Shoplet's eBay DSR rating for "Shipping and handling charges" had been 4.1 at one point, and currently stands at 4.4.

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Readers Comments

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: Out of eBay detox

Thu Nov 27 20:58:56 2008

Blondie was on the right track. Now that Shoplet has reloaded tens of thousands of listings, eBay has started to ''fix'' Shoplet's S&H DSR - its now gone up to 4.5 despite the fact that every buyer who left feedback since yesterday paid $7.50 for S&H. Or maybe I shouldn't be so cynical about eBay ... maybe Shoplet just did a heck of a job ''educating'' its buyers about the need to leave 5 stars ... heh, heh.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: eBuyer Feedback

Fri Nov 28 02:29:42 2008

@ Blondie

Unfortunately the missing negative isn't absolute proof of a coverup because there are reasons within eBay policy for that to happen.  We are currently creating a site that will monitor feedback from these Diamond powersellers and report inconsistencies like the one you mention along with an attempted explanation of why it was removed.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: texas sandy's skeeter

Fri Nov 28 18:26:52 2008

The difference here being, if an ordinary seller somehow manages to get a real customer service rep to remove a feedback, it still shows up, with new text that the feedback has been removed by Ebay. I sell more & at fairer prices than Shoplet but yet, if I list a $2.00 item with 7.50 shipping, I might get suspended for overcharging not these special users. Where are all the lawyers? You would think a greedy bunch like lawyers would be all over the fraudulent changes and starting lawsuits left & right.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

This user has validated their user name. by: Ming the Merciless

Fri Nov 28 19:07:15 2008

@ texas sandy's skeeter

For a private law firm to file suit against ebay or anyone else requires plaintiffs with standing.

Standing means that a plaintiff has been provably and directly affected. Lawyers themselves don't have standing and therefore can't file lawsuits without plaintiffs who do have standing.

The ebay users agreement compels potential plaintiffs to endure the arbitration process. Arbitration judges are, of course, located in San Jose area and while I have no statistics, it wouldn't be surprising if their decisions favored ebay more often than sellers or buyers.

The arbitration process, however, isn't necessarily binding, and once completed, the ebay users agreement conveniently compels plaintiffs to file -- where else -- in the county in which San Jose is located.

The corruption in ebay is so pandemic that only a government lawsuit much like the one filed against the tobacco companies by the state Attorney Generals or the RICO cases brought by DoJ against organized crime figures would be powerful or broadly based enough to facilitate any meaningful change inside ebay.

The current class action scattergun approach is like trying to divert an elephant with a handful of fly swatters.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: formercanadianpowerseller

Fri Nov 28 20:15:35 2008

to: Ming the Merciless

First I want to say THANK YOU for all that you post here.

Second, Canada Law has what is called a KGB statement that makes it possible for people outside of Canada to file a fraud complaint from anywhere in the world against a Canadian business.
Maybe a Class Action suit brought on by a Canadian like myself might be the way to gain attention...?
I have been in talks with a LAW FIRM here in Canada and they will take the case if enough Canadian Sellers come forward.
I hope more do as I am on the verge of losing everything including my house.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: Dannon

Fri Nov 28 20:28:45 2008

@formercanadianpowerseller

You may be onto something. I hope things work out for you. The problem is, by the time these things are settled it isn't going to save your home.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: formercanadianpowerseller

Fri Nov 28 20:33:40 2008

@ Dannon

Thanks for your kind words.
I have a wife, 3 year old boy and 5 month boy - all of us are suffering because of eBay and Paypal.

I am only 36 and on depression and anxiety medication after losing my eBay business.

Not fair for anyone to go through this -especially when it affects so many of us.

I will not go quietly.

eBay pushed me too far and I will not give up.

Yes, I may lose my home BUT I will not give up.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: texas sandy's skeeter

Fri Nov 28 23:03:29 2008

I'm ready anytime a lawyer wants to contact me:) I've been burned by NPBs, gypped by Paypal as buyer & seller, ripped off by bad placement on Ebay, curently in search my items as a 10,000+ F/B powerseller with 99.6% coming in lower in search then a goofball with 4.1 DSrs, and 49 feedback at 96%, lost sales due to forced paypal, and I know 2 other plaintiffs, my sister who had $300 stolen from her by Paypal over a $9 INR, and her account STOLEN and used to sell Nextel phones, which Ebay did nothing to close the acct after being notified repeatedly, and my neighbor, who has been fighting Paypal for 6 months to get $3000 returned after dispute over $900 item SNAD. Shall I continue?

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: AC_in_Mich

Sat Nov 29 10:51:58 2008

I Just can't believe that people buy Shoplet's stuff with the $7.50 shipping charge!  A Dozen ink pens for 10.00?

Has anyone found which feedback disappeared or got changed?

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

This user has validated their user name. by: Ming the Merciless

Sat Nov 29 11:11:52 2008

Of the many things that amaze me about the collective ebay seller 'metric' is the near lobotomized passivity that has afflicted so many ebay sellers.

Sellers tolerated being cheated 95 ways to Sunday before 2008 and said very little. Of course those who did were severely retaliated against.

It's almost as if most sellers had blinders on. Had as many sellers refused to be stolen from and lied to in prior years, a strong argument could be made that ebay might be a different and more profitable marketplace today.

Sellers must shoulder part of the responsibility for allowing ebay to lie, cheat, and steal from them so often for so long. As long as most sellers made some money, no one wanted to make ebay accountable for their growing appetite for sellers' money. And sellers' profits continued to erode and erode and erode as the frogs started to boil.

Then this year when ebay's true corporate character became so obvious that no one could deny that similarities between ebay's modus operandi and the Mafia, sellers finally became disenchanted with ebay.

To make ebay accountable for damages you've suffered at their hands or the destruction of your business, one doesn't passively wait for a lawyer to come knocking on their door and ask if they're interested in filing a lawsuit.

YOU have to initiate contact. Your best bet, however, is to file a well documented case not with a porvate attorney with the consumer protection division of your state Attorney General, send same to the US Department of Justice in Washington, D.C., and contact law firms already involved in lawsuits against ebay.

Unless the case is ready for trial or settlement, plaintiff's lawyers could add additional charges but probably won't.

Here's what typically happens in these class actions and why ebay continues on unscathed by any court.

Lawyers typically take on class action lawsuits on a contingency basis.  This means that rather than the plaintiffs paying them up front and as the case progresses, they will get their compensation at the conclusion of the case which can be much as 50% of the settlement or jury award if they prevail.

So law firms don't take on class action lawsuits unless they feel there a very high probability of winning. Usually the charges are quite narrow because these lawyers tend to winnow seller complaints down to only those that they feel are slam dunk winners and, therefore, are VERY likely to produce a settlement without a trial.

And therein lies the rub of relatively small or narrowly based class actions.

Taking any case to court is very expensive in terms of time and resources and would, therefore, reduce the profitability of a potential monetary settlement for a law firm.

Consequently, lawyers routinely advise their clients to settle without going to trial. Every seller initiated class action against ebay I'm aware of has ended in a sealed settlement.

A sealed settlement is one in which the court prohibits plaintiffs and defendants from publically revealing the terms of settlement.

Result? Typically the law firm gets their percentage (some include expenses and some don't) of whatever monetary settlement was negotiated, and the remaining amount of settlement money is distributed among each plaintiff in class action.

The lawyers could make up to half of whatever they could negotiate with ebay, and plaintiffs end up severely damaged and receive peanuts in private class actions even when they win.

Moreover, settlements of the kind ebay makes might also include provisions such as:

1. Plaintiffs must agree not to participate in any future lawsuits against ebay.

2a. Ebay doesn't have to admit any wrongdoing or admit to the truth of any of the plaintiffs' charges.

2b. or Ebay agrees to cease and desist from continuing a certain practice but we already know from past cases how unreliable ebay is.

3. The amount of money ebay pays to settle is secret. It's far cheaper for ebay to settle than to go to trial under any circumstances, and a settlement guarantees that ebay can continue on conducting business as usual.

Even if ebay were to agree to cease and desist from certain practices in a settlement, ebay has a well publicized history of ignoring court orders and judgements so any concessions may well be unenforceable unless the plaintiffs can persuade their lawyers to go back to court and seek additional relief to compel ebay to fulfill the terms of the settlement.

Sealed settlements permit ebay to continue (not that they ever stopped) abusing and cheating its customers because the privately initiated class action lawsuit fails to publically expose this corporation's fundamentally corrupt business practices and compel ebay to behave in a lawful manner consistent with the Sherman anti trust laws, FTC regulations, SEC regulations, IRS regulations, etc.

If sellers past and present want any permanent change in the way ebay operates, only the government (state Attorney Generals or the US Department of Justice) has the resources to go after ebay in the broadly based manner that is absolutely necessary to expose what I believe is the pandemic corruption and possible myriad of illegal activity this corrupt corporation engages in daily.

Don't just sit there and allow ebay to destroy your business without a fight!

Do at least ONE thing every day to reciprocate!

Death to ebay corp.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

This user has validated their user name. by: Ming the Merciless

Sat Nov 29 13:57:12 2008

When ebay removes feedback, it says in the member's feedback that ebay removed the feedback verbiage and eliminated the rating.

In perusing shoplet's feedback, there is NO such feedback removal entry.

Therefore ebay eliminated all evidence of one negative feedback as if it never occurred.

Another special consideration not offered to any other class of seller, and one who sells an ordinary roll of paper towels for $9.00.

Yo, ebay webinar marketing geniuses! Why don't you suggest your new Diamond pets "slash" their prices several times a week?

Death to ebay corp.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: eBuyer Feedback

Sun Nov 30 01:44:03 2008

@ Ming

That isn't entirely true that eBay leaves a feedback removal entry.  I've had feedback removed off my seller account with no such entry.  There are two cases that I'm aware of that will cause this.

1)  NPB gets a strike without responding to the UPI claim.
2)  Buyer gets suspended at any point in time after that feedback was left.

On that note I've been monitoring BUY's negative and neutral feedback for the past two days and I've already seen one negative disappear.  I just need to figure out which one of 1500+ feedback it was.  What I expect to find is that the buyer is suspended but that may or may not be the case.  I should know later today.

If there is a coverup we'll find it.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: eBuyer Feedback

Sun Nov 30 03:02:00 2008

Just a quick update.  During my investigation I found our records off by two negative feedbacks for BUY.  After a quick investigation it was determined that BOTH negative feedbacks were from suspended users.  They look like deserved negative feedbacks but that is unfortunately how the feedback system works now.

I suspect this is what happened to shoplet as well.  We will continue to monitor both.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: formercanadianpowerseller

Sun Nov 30 11:20:57 2008

I forgot to mention the Law Firm I am dealing with is taking the case PRO BONO.

That is why I want Canadian Sellers to step forward and be heard!

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

This user has validated their user name. by: Ming the Merciless

Sun Nov 30 13:28:44 2008

@ formercanadianpowerseller

"I forgot to mention the Law Firm I am dealing with is taking the case PRO BONO."

Amazing! How refreshing it is to learn that decency and a sense of fair play still govern the legal fraternity in at least one country!

(And, yes, I understand that American lawyers take cases on a pro bono basis every day. But I can't remember one with the potential breadth and depth as this one could have. I hope you won't settle.)

Since American listings are displayed on the Canadian ebay site, can American sellers sign up?

Good luck!

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: V

Sun Nov 30 23:29:28 2008

Better check again, there are over 30,570 listings by this Seller. That was just a temporary bleep.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: PAY ATTENTION!

Mon Dec 1 01:37:44 2008

READ FRUITY'S POST! The FTC and DOJ will act on complaints from BUYERS on eBay! Many, if not MOST, small sellers are also buyers. So PAY HEED to FRUITY's post above!!!

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: Sharyn Koren

Mon Dec 1 08:18:51 2008

It is my understanding that a class action tort can be filed against eBay.  It can originate in any state or county.  Law firms can advertise for clients, in any state and represent them.  Imagine hopw many sellers have been adversly affected by eBay's changes

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

by: formercanadianpowerseller

Mon Dec 1 20:28:18 2008

I just left a  voice mail and email with the Law Firm I am dealing with.
I asked them if American ( or any other seller ) can send their information/story in to them for consideration.
I also have been emailing with Ina and will be giving her more info later this week regarding a Class Action Suit against ebay inc.

eBay/Paypal can not get away with what they have done and continue to do.

Perminate Link for Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay   Shoplet.com Listings Disappear from eBay

This user has validated their user name. by: Ming the Merciless

Mon Dec 1 23:38:29 2008

Law firms can and do advertise. They also solicit class action plaintiffs on TV and newspaper ads such as the meliothelioma ad currently running on TV.

The point I was trying to make and perhaps did badly was that attorneys don't call prospective clients (at least the ethical ones don't) and ask if they file a lawsuit on your behalf.

Class action can originate in any state. However, if you'll read the ebay users agreement, any 'complaints' against ebay must go through the arbitration process in ebay's backyard.

The cases that I'm familiar with originated in one place the cases were transferred to law firms in and around San Jose probably after the arbitration process was completed.

Ebafia puts as many obstacles as they can in front of sellers to discourage lawsuits. They will say this is done to filter out "nuisance" lawsuits with trivial issues.

However, the issues that are discussed every day on these blogs are far from trivial.

The only thing that corporate America understands is profit and loss. They don't care about ethics, common decency, or being a good citizen of this country.

The people who run many American corporations are sociopaths of the worst kind.

A massive class action that incorporates ALL the major questionable ebay practices if successful could cost ebay millions or even billions depending on the extent of the harm plaintiffs could prove.

Moreover, I believe that the class action lawsuit should also include ebay management in their personal capacities as well as corporate capacities.

Some sellers are reported to have lost their homes because of ebay's likely illegal practices. So suing The Ho and the rest of brothel in their personal capacities could cost them their personal assets as well.

Death to ebay corp.

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